Fighting Game Lounge

DoctaMario · October 12, 2020

17 hours ago, rukawa_kaede said:

hmm now I think you're going insane

You've never played a high ping match on rollback then. It's literally unplayable since your opponent will be teleporting around and the only thing you can really do is mash and hope you hit them or hope it's just a lag spike that passes. I had one match I played against some Columbian with taco bell internet on Fightcade where I KO'ed him literally 3 times in one round but it rolled back the first two times.

You can work around a bad connection on delay and it still sucks, but even though it sucks, it's playable. You can account for lag there but there's no way to know where your opponent will be if it's a 300ping match on rollback.

The bar for what's playable on rollback is higher than input delay, but when you hit or exceed that bar, its way worse than delay netcode. This idea that everybody has that rollback is somehow a magic bullet solution for shitty connections is lulz.

Edited October 12, 2020 by DoctaMario

GetTheTables · October 13, 2020

Part of that is I think the discussion being "Interneted". Everyone says rollback is great so therefore it should fix everything. No amount of technical wizardry is going to fix your Wifi warriors or otherwise shitty connections. You also have stuff like SF5 out there muddying the waters with its jank rollback, which is also probably the first rollback experience a lot of players have had.

I've had great connections on both but I'll always choose rollback over delay.

Scanman · October 14, 2020

I invited some people to make Megashock threads for ST, A2, and SFxT and so far only Psychoblue responded.

Other people said either "I don't know what Megashock is" or "Forums are dead bro".

Death to Reddit and Twitter.

misterBee · October 14, 2020

21 minutes ago, Scanman said:

I invited some people to make Megashock threads for ST, A2, and SFxT and so far only Psychoblue responded.

Other people said either "I don't know what Megashock is" or "Forums are dead bro".

Death to Reddit and Twitter.

Don't worry about it man. We'll just keep doing our own thing and making this place nice as possible.

I just spent hours sprucing up an outdated stick database that very few people will ever look at, but that's ok. It's all for the greater good. 👍

Darc_Requiem · October 14, 2020

9 hours ago, Scanman said:

I invited some people to make Megashock threads for ST, A2, and SFxT and so far only Psychoblue responded.

Other people said either "I don't know what Megashock is" or "Forums are dead bro".

Death to Reddit and Twitter.

Hey this place has been around a couple of years. Only in last couple of weeks has things truly picked up. You have to be patient man. I'm not going to lie, I didn't think we'd get to where we are now, but @misterBeehad faith. So I won't doubt his wisdom on the subject any further.

Psychoblue · October 14, 2020

i was talking to someone yesterday about SFxT and the recent Punk/Justin set, and why I broke it down like I did. He had the gall to ask if me or any of the other veterans who never dropped the game could hang with these guys, like I haven't beaten a laundry of dudes who had their trips paid for on a worldwide scale.

Obviously I bragged up my surge of accomplishments when they were fresh, but over time I was getting to a point like Tomo Ohira that the constant surge to stay on top was becoming taxing, not because I was afraid to lose, but because it felt like I was nearing the end of what I could possibly do in that game. Even if there were still people I had to beat, I remember how empty I felt after I won SUmmer Jam 2018, a fully capped SFxT tournament where i didn't lose a single game even though we had "trip paid for" guys like JB, Teiga, Vairos and others.

I don't have any insecurities about who I am and what I accomplished. I only hyped it up so that I could continue drawing interest in SFxT and remind people while things got quieter, it never truly went away. I made sure of that. But all the same, I shouldn't have to constantly flex my rolex because dudes who aren't paying attention but have way too many subscribers to spread bad info want to chime in. I'll be that guy if I need to, but it would be nice if when I say something about something I've been involved in from every possible angle for what's going to be 9 years, and demonstrate what I mean, people don't question who I've beaten to say that. At this point, if you care to know, you're going to know.

Edited October 14, 2020 by Psychoblue

KingTubb · October 14, 2020

Just had a thought...

What if VF Esports is just Sega running VF tournaments at the 2021 olympics?

If anyone would, it'd be fucking Sega.

GetTheTables · October 14, 2020

For as much as I'd love that VF announcement to lead to a new VF, I'm in the camp that thinks at best it'll be a re-release with maybe some updated netcode. Which is at least better than nothing. Would love to be wrong for all the VF heads out there.

YourFavGrandpa · October 14, 2020

3 hours ago, GetTheTables said:

For as much as I'd love that VF announcement to lead to a new VF, I'm in the camp that thinks at best it'll be a re-release with maybe some updated netcode. Which is at least better than nothing.

I would love to see VF5:FS get a remaster/rerelease for modern consoles (Series X/PS5), however I don't see that happening. I also would like to see any version of VF5 come out on PC without having to resort to emulation or pulling out my 360/PS3 in order to play it.

Edited October 14, 2020 by YourFavGrandpa
blah

Illwill88 · October 14, 2020

Well sega did puyoxesports and it was stripped down puyo with multiplayer. So I'm expecting VFxEsports to be the same.

I'm with y'all that I'd love to be proven wrong.

Darc_Requiem · October 14, 2020

Just posting this here in case yall haven't seen it.

iStu X · October 15, 2020

12 hours ago, Darc_Requiem said:

Only in last couple of weeks has things truly picked up.

All we need is for other forums to become morally corrupt and commit arson.

@Darc_Requiem I got to talk to Ryan a bit at every evo I’ve been to except 2k18. Dude is super nice and one of the most humble and helpful people I’ve ever met in the community.

he’s one of the guys I’d watch religiously when learning 3S. Him, Pyrolee, Frankie3S, PinoAB7 and RX.

I’m still subscribed the TheShend on YouTube because they constantly update new and old 3S tourney footage.

Edited October 15, 2020 by iStu X

misterBee · October 15, 2020

6 minutes ago, iStu X said:

All we need is for other forums to become morally corrupt and commit arson.

Other forums don't exist. They're all dead.

What we need is something of value that will drive people here from the platforms they are currently on. Then once they've had a taste of the good stuff we'll hold them hostage.

I thought about allowing people to post status updates on their profile pages like FB/Twitter. People will be able to see your status updates and comment on them just like on social networks.

I've also thought about giving users blogs or creating a wiki. Not sure where I want to take things yet. We've built a cool clubhouse but now we need some kind of attraction that will pull people from Twitter/Reddit/Discord.

It's nbd. Slow and steady wins the race.

Psychoblue · October 15, 2020

FT10 between Punk and Justin last week. This was what brought up the discussion referred to in my last post in this thread.

Commentating is way too much fun. This tiny RR I was hosting wound up being for $230 and change. I'll be announcing the next one soon.

Edited October 15, 2020 by Psychoblue

Hecatom · October 15, 2020

https://www.ign.com/articles/phantom-breaker-omnia-anime-fighting-game-announced

Edited October 15, 2020 by Hecatom

misterBee · October 16, 2020

Accent Core Plus R Steam version getting rollback beta just like KOF!

Scanman · October 16, 2020

1 hour ago, misterBee said:

Accent Core Plus R Steam version getting rollback beta just like KOF!

Interesting how fans making rollback for +R somehow pushed Arcsys to update the netcode for a 10-year-old game.

Happy it's getting some love, because I'm pretty sure I'll still like +R more than Strive.

Psychoblue · October 16, 2020

Edited October 16, 2020 by Psychoblue

Jocelot · October 16, 2020

So is anyone using Fightcade? I've been watching Project Justice match footage on Spooky's channel and have become obsessed. It can't be as easy as downloading it and just finding a Project Justice rom, is it? Because unfortunately none of the Rival Schools games are on Steam

Psychoblue · October 16, 2020

1 hour ago, Jocelot said:

So is anyone using Fightcade? I've been watching Project Justice match footage on Spooky's channel and have become obsessed. It can't be as easy as downloading it and just finding a Project Justice rom, is it? Because unfortunately none of the Rival Schools games are on Steam

I want to run an NGBC tournament on it, just need to find the time.

misterBee · October 16, 2020

1 hour ago, Jocelot said:

So is anyone using Fightcade? I've been watching Project Justice match footage on Spooky's channel and have become obsessed. It can't be as easy as downloading it and just finding a Project Justice rom, is it? Because unfortunately none of the Rival Schools games are on Steam

It is, because unlike old Fightcade, Fightcade 2 uses multiple emulators. In addition to a better version of Final Burn, Fightcade 2 also uses nullDC for NAOMI support.

Go to the Fightcade 2 directory and open up the ROMS folder. You'll see shortcuts to each of the different emulator ROM paths. Place the Project Justice NAOMI rom files in the nullDC ROM folder.

Alternatively, you can use nullDC-BEAR.

It's not rollback and requires you to use RadminVPN to connect with players, but the program downloads ROMs for you automatically. I know some people prefer online CVS2/MVC2 over nullDC-BEAR rather than Fightcade 2.

You can even use nullDC-BEAR to download the appropriate ROMs for you, and then import them into the Fightcade 2 ROM folder.

Since both Fightcade 2 and nullDC-BEAR use nullDC as the base emulator, you SHOULD be able to swap ROM files between them no problem.

Jocelot · October 16, 2020

41 minutes ago, misterBee said:

It is, because unlike old Fightcade, Fightcade 2 uses multiple emulators. In addition to a better version of Final Burn, Fightcade 2 also uses nullDC for NAOMI support.

Go to the Fightcade 2 directory and open up the ROMS directory. You'll see shortcuts to each of the different emulator ROM paths. Place the Project Justice NAOMI rom files in the nullDC ROM folder.

Alternatively, you can use nullDC-BEAR.

It's not rollback and requires you to use RadminVPN to connect with players, but the program downloads ROMs for you automatically. I know some people prefer online CVS2/MVC2 over nullDC-BEAR rather than Fightcade 2.

You can even use nullDC-BEAR to download the appropriate ROMs for you, and then import them into the Fightcade 2 ROM folder.

Since both Fightcade 2 and nullDC-BEAR use nullDC as the base emulator, you SHOULD be able to swap ROM files between them no problem.

Thanks for this, sir. This seems a bit out of my wheelhouse but I'll definitely have to give it a try when I get home.

misterBee · October 16, 2020

1 minute ago, Jocelot said:

Thanks for this, sir. This seems a bit out of my wheelhouse but I'll definitely have to give it a try when I get home.

You can PM me for help if you need it. 👍

Scanman · October 17, 2020

Yeah Naomi is notoriously difficult to emulate. Hopefully we'll get rollback for CvS2, MvC2 etc someday but from what I've been told, the save states are so large that rollback is difficult.

I'm tech illiterate so I don't understand the stuff.

misterBee · October 17, 2020

1 hour ago, Scanman said:

Yeah Naomi is notoriously difficult to emulate. Hopefully we'll get rollback for CvS2, MvC2 etc someday but from what I've been told, the save states are so large that rollback is difficult.

I'm tech illiterate so I don't understand the stuff.

CVS2 and MvC2 are pretty easy to emulate -- they just don't have rollback.

I played CVS2 pretty recently through nullDC-BEAR and it worked fine. Fightcade 2 should have no problems running it either. 👍

DoctaMario · October 17, 2020

On 10/16/2020 at 3:54 AM, misterBee said:

Accent Core Plus R Steam version getting rollback beta just like KOF!

Hoping this gives +R a new lease on life. It's easily my favorite GG game and it's nice to see Arc continuing to give it some love. Hopefully they follow suit with all the other versions of the game besides the steam version.

GetTheTables · October 17, 2020

You'd hope so considering all versions should be similar in terms of implementing rollback.

Ideal world they branch out and start adding rollback to other franchises. Doing another GG makes sense as its maybe close enough structurally to make adding it after Strive not too bad (go for the hat trick and add it to Xrd too, fuck it). But it sure would be neat to see good rollback in GBVS and/or DBFZ.

HeavensCloud · October 17, 2020

1 hour ago, GetTheTables said:

You'd hope so considering all versions should be similar in terms of implementing rollback.

Ideal world they branch out and start adding rollback to other franchises. Doing another GG makes sense as its maybe close enough structurally to make adding it after Strive not too bad (go for the hat trick and add it to Xrd too, fuck it). But it sure would be neat to see good rollback in GBVS and/or DBFZ.

I'd definitely go back to Granblue if they added rollback netcode. It's a great game but the online is so frustrating 😢

GetTheTables · October 17, 2020

3 minutes ago, HeavensCloud said:

I'd definitely go back to Granblue if they added rollback netcode. It's a great game but the online is so frustrating 😢

Yeah I bought the damn thing and never even cracked into it really. Granted that was about the time I was really off of FGs but the general feelings on the GBVS netcode didn't exactly light a fire under me to fire it up.

HeavensCloud · October 18, 2020

1 hour ago, GetTheTables said:

Yeah I bought the damn thing and never even cracked into it really. Granted that was about the time I was really off of FGs but the general feelings on the GBVS netcode didn't exactly light a fire under me to fire it up.

Yeah, if you played during the initial 2 month 'hype' period it was okay since there were so many people playing. If you were matched up with someone they were most likely close by. I grinded up to S rank with Zeta..... but once the game started to die out it was such a chore to find ranked matches. And the lobby system is terrible, you queue up with people and you can't even see their connection so it turns into a guessing game.

Similar thing happened with Samsho, it's a shame some of these games lose steam after a few months because of online.

Edited October 18, 2020 by HeavensCloud

Psychoblue · October 18, 2020

Made another BFTG community roundup vid.

Hawkingbird · October 18, 2020

Edited October 18, 2020 by Hawkingbird

Psychoblue · October 20, 2020

Made one for Dudley this time.

Darc_Requiem · October 23, 2020

Saw something cool at around 9:35 of this video, hope the link starts at the time stamp. A guy is replicating classic matches frame perfecr in HD. He wants to make sure they are preserved. I think it's pretty cool.

Edited October 27, 2020 by Darc_Requiem

Psychoblue · October 27, 2020

Time for the Ickey Shuffle!

Psychoblue · October 28, 2020

Did anyone catch wind of what went down in the Vampire Savior community over the weekend?

DoctaMario · October 28, 2020

2 hours ago, Psychoblue said:

Did anyone catch wind of what went down in the Vampire Savior community over the weekend?

Probably the community sperging out over nothing like usual.

Psychoblue · October 28, 2020

3 minutes ago, DoctaMario said:

Probably the community sperging out over nothing like usual.

one of the combatants I actually know outside of FGC. She helped me move into my place and before then she was a student when I was helping teach band camp.

As for the other combatant, he seems nice enough when I spoke to him but I don't know him personally. It's a shame people can't get along and be civil when we're all stuck here in this pandemic nightmare. Gaming should be like pizza, something that brings joy when there is none before its partaking.

DoctaMario · October 28, 2020

47 minutes ago, Psychoblue said:

one of the combatants I actually know outside of FGC. She helped me move into my place and before then she was a student when I was helping teach band camp.

As for the other combatant, he seems nice enough when I spoke to him but I don't know him personally. It's a shame people can't get along and be civil when we're all stuck here in this pandemic nightmare. Gaming should be like pizza, something that brings joy when there is none before its partaking.

I don't even know what the drama was this time around, but i remember all the stuff that went down with Dyne and how shitty people were both to him and people who supported him. Vampire Arcadia even blocked me on Twitter because I liked a couple tweets in support of him. You'd think a small community like theirs would try to get along better and iron things out within rather than broadcasting it to Twitter.

DoctaMario · October 28, 2020

I have a bit of a philosophical question for you guys based on some conversations I've had in the 3s and SamSho5Sp communities.

With most games, especially if the netcode isn't up to snuff, often times two different metas develop, the online and offline, and the common belief that the offline version of any game is the one that matters, since it's the one that's played competitively.

That said, if most players are playing the game online, and given Covid and how offline events aren't happening now, one could argue that the online meta is the more important one. People often look down on "online tactics" but if the online meta is the one most players are playing, and those tactics aren't obviously bullshit, abusing lag, etc, should they be discouraged?

Obviously the best of all possible worlds is the online and offline metas being the same or as close to the same as possible, but in a world where that's rarely the case, should we be focusing more on the meta that more players have access to and are experiencing that competitive players could also access, or the one that a small portion of a game's community will likely ever experience?

btw I hate the word "meta" but I don't know a better word to describe what I'm talking about 😂

TL;DR: if more players play online then offline & offline events are cancelled, does that mean the online version is more important than the offline version?

Edited October 28, 2020 by DoctaMario
TL;dr

misterBee · October 29, 2020

The only thing that's important is the version of the game you are playing.

If you play online, pay attention to online strats. If you play offline, pay attention to offline strats.

I don't really see the point in trying to argue which meta is the 'real' one.

AriesWarlock · October 29, 2020

the owner of freestepdodge.com remastered Dead or Alive 2's cinematic intro, 8K and 60fps 🤩 🤘

Edited October 29, 2020 by AriesWarlock

Scanman · October 30, 2020

On 10/29/2020 at 6:29 AM, DoctaMario said:

TL;DR: if more players play online then offline & offline events are cancelled, does that mean the online version is more important than the offline version?

I think one point would be that "offline strats" would still work correctly online (if you're in rollback). EG Alpha 2:

Sakura's crossup into uppercut loop works offline or online.

Doing Adon's jaguar kick (which is unsafe even on hit, unless you hit an extended limb) and then activating CC or super to try to catch their punish will probably only work online.

Same with ST: Claw's walldive loop always works. Ken spamming Jab shoryu does not (probably).

So it's important to know all the online gimmicks, and also know that they prolly won't work against a tournament player offline.

DoctaMario · October 30, 2020

10 hours ago, misterBee said:

The only thing that's important is the version of the game you are playing.

If you play online, pay attention to online strats. If you play offline, pay attention to offline strats.

I don't really see the point in trying to argue which meta is the 'real' one.

It's usually offline/tourney players I see arguing about it most of the time.

M A R T I A N · October 30, 2020

If the netcode is good enough, those offline strats work online too. Simple as that. 🤷🏾‍♂️

Edited October 30, 2020 by M A R T I A N

GetTheTables · October 30, 2020

It feels kinda reductive but you can only play the game in front of you. You can maybe argue developer intent/design - older games couldn't have been built with online play in mind whereas current gen ones arguably should ne - but if a version of a game doesn't really exist for people to play then its kinda moot.

Doesn't even need to be online vs offline, look at release client SF5 and its high input lag. That was a real pain in the ass and everyone knew that it should be better, that there was stuff you were way more likely to get away with due to the 6-8 frames of lag. But everyone just kind of had to live with that reality until circumstances changed. EX Dolphin Dives for days motherfuckers!

I think its definitely more painful having known the alternative and having it taken away temporarily. But can't do shit about that right now unfortunately so best we can all do is treat this like a wacky remix edition period and have what fun with it we can. Hopefully as more games get designed with rollback in mind or get it ported it becomes less of a problem.