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The Return of.. Terribly Unpopular Opinions.


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8 hours ago, DoctaMario said:

How serious is Dream Hack tho? If I were playing in one of those tournaments I wouldn't take that seriously at all. People are already complaining about lag in the Evo online tournaments, if PC specs come into the picture it's going to be a shit show. 

 

I say this as someone who played thousands of hours on fightcade,  but if real money was on the line? Word....?

Dreamhack is super big, and is run multiple times a year in various locations world-wide.  Prize pools are often in the hundreds of thousands of dollars.  Dreamhack is way bigger than anything in the FGC, and has been around since 1994.  It's also a LAN tournament -- meaning it's played offline.

 

Any proper tournament is going to have entire sets of identical PCs with proper specs.  Specs aren't ever going to be an issue.  First place in the LoL World Championship last year was almost a million dollars, and every player used the same PCs, provided by the venue.

 

The ONLY thing consoles have going for them is that they're cheap.  They're not inherently more consistent  or better.  I've seen certain PS4s lag more than others, or suffer from heat problems and affect matches.

 

Being afraid of the system specs when you go to a  PC tourney only applies to small local tournaments where the organizers don't know what they're doing,  and are trying to run setups using their shitty laptop.

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Posted (edited)

yeah, it's a shame that Epic's online storefront would ever be taken seriously, imo... the minute I heard it effectively makes everything online only, then of course that instantly made the whole deal shit....sadly, I think that is a bad look for the general gaming audience, imo.

 

"Hey, here's a car I'll sell ya... but keep in mind you don't actually own it, and you can only drive it whenever I decide you are allowed to do so.  Also, I can take it away from you at any time for a long list of reasons that are, of course, beyond your control...and occasionally I will drop by your house to *check* and verify that it is you driving the car and no one else; gotta authenticate ya before you get behind the wheel of 'your' car, y'know....how's that sound?"

Gaming Audience: "Awesome! Sign me up for THAT!"

stupid youtube GIF

Edited by MillionX
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2 hours ago, misterBee said:

Dreamhack is super big, and is run multiple times a year in various locations world-wide.  Prize pools are often in the hundreds of thousands of dollars.  Dreamhack is way bigger than anything in the FGC, and has been around since 1994.  It's also a LAN tournament -- meaning it's played offline.

 

Any proper tournament is going to have entire sets of identical PCs with proper specs.  Specs aren't ever going to be an issue.  First place in the LoL World Championship last year was almost a million dollars, and every player used the same PCs, provided by the venue.

 

The ONLY thing consoles have going for them is that they're cheap.  They're not inherently more consistent  or better.  I've seen certain PS4s lag more than others, or suffer from heat problems and affect matches.

 

Being afraid of the system specs when you go to a  PC tourney only applies to small local tournaments where the organizers don't know what they're doing,  and are trying to run setups using their shitty laptop.

I haven't heard anything about Dreamhack in ages, I didn't know they were even still going. 

 

Consoles are overall a more consistent piece of hardware though unless you have, a venue for instance, getting identical setups and getting them all ready the same way. Plus, LoL is largely kb/mouse anyway isn't it? You don't have the same kinds of issues with those vs controllers. 

 

 

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4 hours ago, DarkSakul said:

Only good thing about Space Jam was how long their website lasted.

 

Till this new Piece of shit killed it. 

Regardless of your opinion on the movie, I’m here to tell you that the website is still alive.

 

https://www.spacejam.com/1996/

 

If this link doesn’t work, click the Space Jam logo on the top right on the new site.

 

image0.png

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5 hours ago, DoctaMario said:

Consoles are overall a more consistent piece of hardware though unless you have, a venue for instance, getting identical setups and getting them all ready the same way. Plus, LoL is largely kb/mouse anyway isn't it? You don't have the same kinds of issues with those vs controllers.

If the FGC ever switches to the PC model they are more than likely going to be using the venue-provided PC model anyway.  If I'm not mistaken Wednesday Night Fights did this for a while near the end of SF4.

 

The only reason people have controller issues is because they're trying to use controllers not designed for PC to begin with.  PS3/PS4 controllers aren't made to work on PC -- Sony does not care about PC support, and does not support Xinput, which is the established PC standard.

 

All a tournament running on PCs has to do is say 'XBOX CONTROLLERS ONLY' and all of a sudden it becomes a non-issue.

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35 minutes ago, misterBee said:

If the FGC ever switches to the PC model they are more than likely going to be using the venue-provided PC model anyway.  If I'm not mistaken Wednesday Night Fights did this for a while near the end of SF4.

 

The only reason people have controller issues is because they're trying to use controllers not designed for PC to begin with.  PS3/PS4 controllers aren't made to work on PC -- Sony does not care about PC support, and does not support Xinput, which is the established PC standard.

 

All a tournament running on PCs has to do is say 'XBOX CONTROLLERS ONLY' and all of a sudden it becomes a non-issue.

Eh.

 

Consoles are more consistent, regardless of the occasional dud.

 

Streamlining has its benefits.

 

As does en masse production.

 

Do not take this the wrong way.

 

I am a diehard PC elitist.

 

But I am also practical, and consoles are far more pragmatic.

 

The console is for the plebing room.

 

The Falcon Northwest is for the Bat-Man Cave.

Edited by JHDK
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6 minutes ago, JHDK said:

Eh.

 

Consoles are more consistent, regardless of the occasional dud.

 

Streamlining has its benefits.

 

As does en masse production.

 

Do not take this the wrong way.

 

I am a diehard PC elitist.

 

But I am also practical, and consoles are far more pragmatic.

 

The console is for the plebing room.

 

The Falcon Northwest is for the Bat-Man Cave.

I think consoles are more pragmatic and economical, but not really more 'consistent'. 

 

For example, if you go to a store today and buy 10 i3 NUCs they are all going to run exactly same.

 

The PC as a platform isn't 'inconsistent' unless you start comparing different hardware configurations, and any properly planned tourney isn't going to have that problem.

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9 minutes ago, misterBee said:

I think consoles are more pragmatic and economical, but not really more 'consistent'. 

 

For example, if you go to a store today and buy 10 i3 NUCs they are all going to run exactly same.

 

The PC as a platform isn't 'inconsistent' unless you start comparing different hardware configurations, and any properly planned tourney isn't going to have that problem.

True.

 

But I just rather doubt any tourney is going to run PC for widely different games, with inevitable performance variance, given whatever is uniformly under the hood.

 

Consoles have the added benefit of the games having been tuned to their precise, established parameters, whereas PC versions are a free for all that way.

 

Of course we elitist pricks shall have the best parts. But that's not viable economically for tourneys. And even the best specs out there will shit the bed when a poorly optimized game shows up e.g. Borderlands 3, etc, et al.

 

 

 

 

Edited by JHDK
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A fighting game doesn't need the best specs. The games are locked at 60 FPS and the stages and character models ain't pushing anything limits. A mid range rig will play any fighting game you throw at it no problem.  Sprite based games could run off integrated graphics if you want it to.

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7 hours ago, misterBee said:

For example, if you go to a store today and buy 10 i3 NUCs they are all going to run exactly same.

 

The PC as a platform isn't 'inconsistent' unless you start comparing different hardware configurations, and any properly planned tourney isn't going to have that problem.

And if you go to the store in six months and buy another NUC it will probably run almost exactly the same.

 

If you've got some eSports corporate sponsorship, sure, go buy a couple dozen identical computers and go nuts.  If you're a local that's begging people to bring setups so the tournament doesn't take twice as long to run PC isn't going to work as well.  Even majors with sponsors providing hardware for a flagship game are pulling systems from other TOs to run the entirety of their lineup.

 

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8 hours ago, Hawkingbird said:

A fighting game doesn't need the best specs. The games are locked at 60 FPS and the stages and character models ain't pushing anything limits. A mid range rig will play any fighting game you throw at it no problem.  Sprite based games could run off integrated graphics if you want it to.

Tekken 7?

 

Not when it came out, it damned sure didn't.

 

A 1080 GTX Founders coupled with a top end processor and the best SSD, still took a long-ass while to load.

 

The PS4 version was faster with an SSD.

 

EDIT:

 

I swear, the ghetto-ass load times of that shitstain on the FG genre known as SFV, has made otherwise functional people tolerate of complete and utter bullshit delays, as well total trash served and run up the flagpole as a sequel to what used to be the flagship series of the genre.

 

3S was basically a litmus test fishing for the lowest bounds for the bottom threshold for taste cancer that made itself manifest as SFV.

 

Edited by JHDK
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47 minutes ago, JHDK said:

Tekken 7?

 

Not when it came out, it damned sure didn't.

 

A 1080 GTX Founders coupled with a top end processor and the best SSD, still took a long-ass while to load.

 

The PS4 version was faster with an SSD.

 

EDIT:

 

I swear, the ghetto-ass load times of that shitstain on the FG genre known as SFV, has made otherwise functional people tolerate of complete and utter bullshit delays, as well total trash served and run up the flagpole as a sequel to what used to be the flagship series of the genre.

 

3S was basically a litmus test fishing for the lowest bounds for the bottom threshold for taste cancer that made itself manifest as SFV.

 

Check Tekken 7 system specs. It needs a 4th gen i3 and GTX 660. Low end hardware of 2012. Modern hardware would run a train on that game.

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Most games do a shitty job of "boss death" especially JRPGs/JARPGs

 

It grinds my gears when I beat the ever living shit out of a boss and they cut to a cutscene where they go 

"Heh, I almost broke as sweat, maybe one day you'll be able to defeat me, heh" and they run away like a bitch while my character is panting and all tired and shit. 

 

Bosses should just blow up. Blowing up is always appropriate. Killer boss fight? Blowing up at the end is satisfying. Boss was a cakewalk? I just whooped it so bad that it EXPLODED!

 

The only thing worse than the "lol see ya loser" end to a boss fight is the bethesda ragdoll "GWAAHHH" death in fallout/ES. It's funny more often that rewarding or exciting. 

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11 hours ago, misterBee said:

PS3/PS4 controllers aren't made to work on PC -- Sony does not care about PC support, and does not support Xinput, which is the established PC standard.

That only half right. PS3/PS4 controllers are designed with PC Support in Mind, they are Dinput compatible. PS3 controllers worked with what was the PC environment at the time. PS4 controllers work if you don't mind Dinput only or got the means of converting Dinput to Xinput. 
Microsoft for DX12 onwards mostly use Xinput for Controller input and Sony didn't want to pay up for the license of a MS proprietary driver for a  MS proprietary API.
10+ years ago this wasn't a issue when PS3 was new, now it is as MS has very much a say what is goes on on the PC landscape. 
 

PC games if they wanted to could support Dinput, but they don't. The PC Version of SF 5 shipped with Input support originally but dropped it an update. 

Sony does care about PC support, they just don't want to pay MS for the use of Xinput driver support.

The new PS5 Dual Sense pads work with PC, it also counts as a USB audio device as well as a game pad, it just lacks that Xinput support. 

 

11 hours ago, misterBee said:

If the FGC ever switches to the PC model they are more than likely going to be using the venue-provided PC model anyway. 

Because FGC follows the old model of we supply the system(s)

Larger PC only Tournaments outside of the FGC is mostly  "BRING YOUR OWN GEAR" which includes the PC and Monitor. 
Star Craft tourneys been that way for decades now. 
 

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2 hours ago, Hawkingbird said:

Check Tekken 7 system specs. It needs a 4th gen i3 and GTX 660. Low end hardware of 2012. Modern hardware would run a train on that game.

It still loaded a lot longer on the front end than on console. And the transitions into battle were longer.

 

Source:

 

Owned an i7 with a 1080 GTX Founders and the best SSD available at the time, circa. 2017, as well as a PS4... both with Tekken 7.

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2 minutes ago, JHDK said:

It still loaded a lot longer on the front end than on console. And the transitions into battle were longer.

 

Source:

 

Owned an i7 with a 1080 GTX Founders and the best SSD available at the time, circa. 2017, as well as a PS4... both with Tekken 7.

Load times is only a benchmark when comparing harddrives. It ain't got nothing to do with how well a game runs. Tekken 7 can run on a toaster. 

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3 minutes ago, Hawkingbird said:

Load times is only a benchmark when comparing harddrives. It ain't got nothing to do with how well a game runs. Tekken 7 can run on a toaster. 

Load times are also a fact of how well-coded something is.

 

Tekken 7 was better coded on the PS4.

 

At least circa. 2017.

 

I haven't bothered with it on PC since 2018.

 

The PS4 environment is simply better.

Edited by JHDK
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4 hours ago, JHDK said:

A 1080 GTX Founders coupled with a top end processor and the best SSD, still took a long-ass while to load.

 

The PS4 version was faster with an SSD.

That...can't be right.

 

The PS4 doesn't even properly use SSDs at their full speed.  I had Tekken 7 on console and later on PC at launch and the PC version loaded many times faster than the PS4 one.

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3 hours ago, JHDK said:

People who downvote in an "Unpopular Opinions" thread are funny for completely unintentional reasons.

People have the choices to do what they want.
Even in the unpopular opinion thread, if you post trash, expect others to respond in kind. 
The thread theme and topic does not make you immune to criticism.  

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1 hour ago, Hawkingbird said:

My experience with PC Tekken is that it definitely loads faster on PC. I have the game installed on a nvme. The frames still drop on the versus screen which never stops being funny.

Sounds like poorly unoptimized code to me. 

 

1 hour ago, misterBee said:

That...can't be right.

 

The PS4 doesn't even properly use SSDs at their full speed.  I had Tekken 7 on console and later on PC at launch and the PC version loaded many times faster than the PS4 one.

Keep in mind Most PC games runs on Windows with DX APIs running, PS4 runs on a Sony custom Unix-based OS with completely different APIs.

I take it as Namco don't optimized the code well for the Windows version. I see a few other Console First games being ass on PC (w/o mods to fix it)
Example Nier: Automata is also ass on PC. 

 

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9 minutes ago, DarkSakul said:

Keep in mind Most PC games runs on Windows with DX APIs running, PS4 runs on a Sony custom Unix-based OS with completely different APIs.

I take it as Namco don't optimized the code well for the Windows version. I see a few other Console First games being ass on PC (w/o mods to fix it)
Example Nier: Automata is also ass on PC.

While Nier is quite bad on PC, Tekken is a perfectly good port.  The game definitely runs much better on PC - it's part of the reason why all the Tekken pros in Korea play on PC whenever possible.

 

The load times in PC Tekken are 100% faster than PS4, even when both machines are using SSDs.  If the PS4 version is loading faster than the PC one then something is definitely wrong.

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20 minutes ago, DarkSakul said:

People have the choices to do what they want.
Even in the unpopular opinion thread, if you post trash, expect others to respond in kind. 
The thread theme and topic does not make you immune to criticism.  

The literal perfect example of all that an unpopular opinion could be, were factually incorrect assertions merely simpleminded gutter trash opinings.

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14 minutes ago, DangerousJ said:

rye chips are the worst part of chex mix.

Okay.

 

Now THIS is a prime example of a truly unpopular opinion.

 

I would agree with you, except I have the good sense to forego the rest of the Chex and simply buy bags of pure rye chips, and thus circumvent ceding the point by proxy of the crime of associating the godly aspect of rye chips with the rest of Chex... meaning that the abuse of rye chips is the worst aspect of Chex.

Edited by JHDK
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11 minutes ago, JHDK said:

i thought I was the only one.

It's.... Fine. 

 

But there were people saying it was overlooked because it dropped the same year as  BoTW and P5, and any other year it would be a GOTY. 

 

I dunno, man. It's aight, but I fizzled out on everything about it by the time I hit ending on the second playthrough. Hacking made the combat boring imho, and the story started to lose steam. 

 

I got through the third ending and didn't care to see the rest of the endings. 

 

I mean, it's still a solid game as far as gameplay wise (at least for the first one and a half play throughs), and if you're into heady sci-fi anime (I'm looking at you, Eva) you'd probably dig the story, but it didn't really click with me. 

 

Definitely had some really cool parts and some charming characters and moments, but overall, 🤷‍♀️

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38 minutes ago, KingTubb said:

It's.... Fine. 

 

But there were people saying it was overlooked because it dropped the same year as  BoTW and P5, and any other year it would be a GOTY. 

 

I dunno, man. It's aight, but I fizzled out on everything about it by the time I hit ending on the second playthrough. Hacking made the combat boring imho, and the story started to lose steam. 

 

I got through the third ending and didn't care to see the rest of the endings. 

 

I mean, it's still a solid game as far as gameplay wise (at least for the first one and a half play throughs), and if you're into heady sci-fi anime (I'm looking at you, Eva) you'd probably dig the story, but it didn't really click with me. 

 

Definitely had some really cool parts and some charming characters and moments, but overall, 🤷‍♀️

People who think Nier was underrated or overlooked are insane.

 

That game came out and was greeted with lot of praise and acclaim from both players and press.  Lots of people were talking about it.

 

The people who thought Nier was overlooked on release are probably the same people that won't stop telling you how Breath of the Wild is the greatest thing since sliced bread and how much they love their Switch.  Everybody else was well aware of it.

 

I personally love it and it's in one of my top 10.  Story and atmosphere are top notch.

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40 minutes ago, misterBee said:

That game came out and was greeted with lot of praise and acclaim from both players and press.  Lots of people were talking about it.

Exactly, but you know how stans get down. Being universally praised isn't enough. I very much remember people complaining it wasn't even nominated for game of the year at the game awards.

 

But if you care about the game awards sincerely, you're kind of a lost cause. 

 

Also, @Voltyou need to get in here with your Mario 64 takes, this is the perfect place for them

 

 

Edited by KingTubb
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I was bored to tears by Nier Automata.

 

I kept struggling to keep going, in hopes of its getting better, but it never did.

 

Boredom bested my best efforts at masochism right around when you fight the dudes in the desert city. But damned if I didn't try to like it. I really did.

Edited by JHDK
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16 minutes ago, JHDK said:

I was bored to tears by Nier Automata.

I agreed it got boring quite quickly. 
For a Linear Game, it has sandbox like eras that has no visual or thematic clues what is going on or what direction to take  
So its easy to get lost with no direction and nothing to hold interests. If you going to go into Sandbox mode, you need sandbox attention getters.

The Legend of Zelda for the NES did Sandbox better than Nier Automata and that's said something that a game from 1987 with it's minimalist approach does more than a modern game from 2017. At least the NES Zelda set up expectations from the start that you need to explore every nook and cranny by not even giving you a starter weapon. 
Nier was, here go this mission that was already in progress, do this Shmup segment, Fight this OP Boss, now some boring cutscene you forget about before its over and plop you into a Fallout city with no expectations or explanations (as you ignored the cut scene).
And when you do find you are going the right way, you find robots fucking each other, literally. 

All Nier really had was bizarre anime ascetics and a pretty female protagonist set in a spin off, of a spin off, of a spin off. 

 

1 hour ago, misterBee said:

People who think Nier was underrated or overlooked are insane.

 

That game came out and was greeted with lot of praise and acclaim from both players and press.  Lots of people were talking about it.

It Nier Automata is way overhyped, and if I didn't get it on a summer sale of $10 on Steam I would of been pissed how much of a let down Nier was. 

 

1 hour ago, misterBee said:

The people who thought Nier was overlooked on release are probably the same people that won't stop telling you how Breath of the Wild is the greatest thing since sliced bread and how much they love their Switch.  Everybody else was well aware of it.

 BOTW Works as they set up early on whats the expectations for exploration and give the players the tools to learn how to explore and what the visual clues are. 
Everything feature wise in BOTW was tested in a 8 bit 2D version of the game first (ala NES style) and if they can't covey that feature or item in 2D 8bit game play, they don't bring it into modern 3D space. 

All Nier had was a producer who liked to troll the fuck out of people 

Edited by DarkSakul
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I'll do it for @Volt:

 

Mario 64 sucks.  It was revolutionary but also trash.  Ocarina of Time is whatever.

 

Mario and Zelda games are more over-hyped than Nier will ever be.  Even as a child growing up with 8-bit/16-bit consoles I thought Mario was adequate but boring as hell.

 

@DarkSakulyou're a cool guy but Nier is wonderful and I will never stop saying how wrong you are. 🙂

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Back in '96 or whenever it came out it was pretty dope.  I put it on my Vita just a couple days ago cause...why not?  Its not so great.  The controls are meh and it looks really bland.  I only played a bit but it was boring.

 

The music when you are selecting a save slot is good.

 

 

 

Everyone says its great but I think its lame - Sekiro.  I thought it was boring as all hell. 

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3 hours ago, misterBee said:

I'll do it for @Volt:

 

Mario 64 sucks.  It was revolutionary but also trash.  Ocarina of Time is whatever.

 

Mario and Zelda games are more over-hyped than Nier will ever be.  Even as a child growing up with 8-bit/16-bit consoles I thought Mario was adequate but boring as hell.

 

@DarkSakulyou're a cool guy but Nier is wonderful and I will never stop saying how wrong you are. 🙂

The best 8 bit Mario was a Doki Doki Panic reskin.

 

The best 16 bit one was Dino Daycare.

 

Dino Daycare was one of the top 5 games of the 16-bit era.

 

So was ALttP.

 

Nier was boring, its MC was dressed like a 45 year old virgin's attempt at making his loli fetish look legit, and her stan's shorts were gay as all fuck.

 

The only even remotely interesting thing to come of Nier requires Pornhub or its ilk.

 

Fight me. :coffee:

Edited by JHDK
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7 minutes ago, JHDK said:

Nier was boring, its MC was dressed like a 45 year old virgin's attempt at making his loli fetish look legit, and her stan's shorts were gay as all fuck.

 

The only even remotely interest thing to come of Nier requires Pornhub or its ilk.

 

Fight me. :coffee:

Another boomer distracted by the anime titties and failing to see the great story underneath.  😔

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1 minute ago, misterBee said:

Another boomer distracted by the anime titties and failing to see the great story underneath.  😔

What titties?

 

All I saw was a tryhard and fail samurai in high heels and a leotard, flailing blindly enough to make Zatoichi reach for his wakizashi in shame.

 

What is this story of which you speak?

 

Hailey Joel Osment Electric Sheep-a-loo?

 

 

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6 minutes ago, JHDK said:

What titties?

 

All I saw was a tryhard and fail samurai in high heels and a leotard, flailing blindly enough to make Zatoichi reach for his wakizashi in shame.

 

What is this story of which you speak?

 

Hailey Joel Osment Electric Sheep-a-loo?

LOL now I know you're trolling.

 

It's ok.  Not everyone can understand brilliance.  :coffee:

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8 hours ago, Faltimar the Dark said:

Everyone says its great but I think its lame - Sekiro.  I thought it was boring as all hell. 

Man, that's certainly a unique take. How far did you get into it? 

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8 hours ago, JHDK said:

Nier Automata was the Suckpunch of game storytelling.

As it was all over the place, incohesive and didn't make much sense.

 

8 hours ago, misterBee said:

Not everyone can understand brilliance.

There a thin line between brilliance and insanity, Nier Automata crossed that line by a mile. 

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