Reiraku

I think we're both ultimately saying the same thing, but defining the terms differently, ie my using "success" with regularity while you use it more towards scope or scale. I think that she does what she does as well as she does (to be put in as broad a terms as possible to avoid confusion) is due to the hurdles she has to climb not being as grand as his, but she has had to do so near consistantly. Alternatively, what he has to deal with his so mammoth in scale, that he feels it discredits her experiences. He is not right, but neither was she. Also, I will try to avoid mentioning real life parallels as much as possible. I'd rather not offend someone over a real life experience because we're talking about fake green people.

So, in short, she's more successful than him, and while he is not as successful, he still does so to the general safety of others around him due to various efforts, including machines and other training (yoga, etc). Am I incorrect in any of this?

Want to define control, in your opinion, on this for me? I'd really like to understand what you feel would fall in that definition

Don't you take medication for a heart condition? Or am I misremembering?

Also, why is there an assumption that my problem with that scene is because she's a woman? At what point did I ever state anything of the sort?

Nah. Like I said, make that conversation happen with any other member of the MCU, and I'd support it 100%. Maybe my perspective is colored a bit, since I have a lot of experience working with behavioral instabilities, mental illness, etc, but I find the idea of someone using every resource they can to not go berserk being told that they're not controlling it and are just pretending to be pretty tasteless.

He's not pretending because both of those are him. That's the part he had to come to terms with in Endgame. He's still Banner, but he's the Hulk too. The device he wears doesn't change his anger, rage, and frustration. It just suppresses the biology that the gamma radiation gave him to change his appearance.

When that's one of the most shown scenes in the marketing for the show, and it feels out of touch with the surrounding details, it doesn't do much to inspire one to watch the show. Now if you tell me Bruce later sits down with Jen and just tells her everything he had to do to get to where he is, and she's taken back and apologizes for her outburst while he does the same for his lack of perspective, I'd watch this show in a heartbeat.

I disagree with this. By Endgame, he's controlling it VERY well. Having issues like these and not lashing out all the time is definitely controlling it. And using outside sources, whether it be machines or medication, is doing loads more to control it than most do. He's doing a great job at controlling it. The suffering comes with trauma regardless, but he's keeping it in check and succeeding. If only everyone with similar problems could do the same

I'm going to have to take your word on it and check out the series when I can. In a vacuum, it's a very poor way to represent their respective struggles.

I agree with you on how Bruce was assuming how Jen didn't know how to keep her cool. He's definitely making a dumb assumption there. Likewise though, she was wrong for saying that she does it more than him, in my opinion. I just can't compare her life experiences to life or death PTSD, survivor's guilt, and attempted suicide.

It's valid if it weren't for one thing, that she says she does it infinitely more than Bruce. Strike that one part from the statement, and I am in full agreement with her. If she were talking to just about anyone else, she'd have a definite point. He's one of the few people where that comparison doesn't work.

Let me try to put it another way. Persona A: "Why are you complaining you have to travel 3 miles to get groceries? I have to travel 6 miles! I have it way harder than you!" Person B: "You have a car. I'm walking with a cane in a bad neighborhood." I'm not mad that she had it better, but that she's saying that she had it worse.

To clarify: I'm not saying the show itself is bad, or that it's dumb, "woke", or any such descriptor. Only that the scene I am referring to left a bad taste in my mouth for the reasons described. I might watch it sometime in the future, since it pulls a lot from one of my favorite book runs, I'm just not inspired much to do so now.

I think the disagreement we're having here is a matter of success vs effort. Jen is absolutely more successful than Bruce in controlling her emotions, no doubt, but she also doesn't have to work as hard at it. I didn't want to include the reasons from the books because even the shows themselves don't follow those as much, so it wouldn't really apply as cleanly. Bruce has to work harder at it because the hurdles he has to overcome in controlling himself are degrees larger than what Jen has. He is successful, but it took a lot more work over a longer period of time due to these factors. Jen, by comparison, has not gone through the same things. She's successful as well, but she doesn't have as much to overcome to be successful. She's not working harder, she just has less to work with.

She's talking about being patronized by her asshole coworkers compared to her cousin who had to battle to maintain control of his body vs a literal inner monster, suffered massive PTSD and secluded himself due to the people he hurt and didn't want to hurt more, and actually tried to kill himself, and that was before he was beat to hell and back by the guy he wasn't strong enough to stop from ending half of the life in the universe. There really is no comparison in the amount of mental stressors between the two. Her saying she had to work infinitely harder than him lacks self-awareness on a huge scale.

Haven't watched the show, but I find the clip of her telling Bruce that she has to work infinitely harder than him (paraphrasing here) to control her anger took me out.

I've sold jewelry to him before. Nice guy.

That's right up the street from where I used to live. I'm also 100% not surprised it happened there.

I always liked the Kubert brothers work. They did awesome stuff.

The first comic I was able to buy myself was Thor 429. After that, it was X-Men, Spider-Man, Wolverine, all the 90's classics. My brother and I even got big into Darkhawk when it first came out.

Here's to a speedy recovery and the absolute minimum of symptoms, sir.

@Gimpy