Sonero

Fuudo got his wife cooking too:
 
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

I started implementing delay block + parry os more mindfully lately and it's so crazy how op drive parry is in this game man. Basically get to block twice with a chance of guaranteed damage FOR BLOCKING and not need to worry much about any mixups besides throws.

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

What I'm saying is that a lot of "old heads" don't want to talk about how they took advantage of system things that were that way to make life easier for players. Increased throw invul frame is a direct contrast to SF2 where you could get dunked at times. Its dishonest to say the system is easier now when being able to fully wake up with hella defensive protection is something you can do in 3S.
 
There are things that are strong to the point of being scrubby in older games. Like bro, how much out playing is 3S Ken really doing? The guy has the best offense, best confirms from multiple buttons etc. Chun is even wilder. You think dudes are carried because the second half of the cast is strong than before? Chun beats 15 characters for free with 2 buttons: cr.mk and st.hp.
 
"Oh no modern games are so baby shit". Yeah, totally. The thing about MvC3 that made it baby shit was that the best zoner in the game couldn't do a full screen projectile on his incoming opponent, disable their ability to block by doing it and then ToD them from full screen. There's system stuff that sucked flaming ass in older games. People exploited it. It made the game harder for reasons that were, if we're being honest, actually bad.
 
I love these old games but they have flaws. Some of them were from design mechanics that didn't work as intended, other are glitches, etc. The way people talk about games in the FGC lacks so much nuance. There's too much of people talking about both sides of their mouth when it comes to system and design stuff.

Watching niggas lose their mind over Tekken 8
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

I went to the big Boston local last night and got top 8 for sf6. It was a good time.

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

Went to a Strive local, got 2nd place, won 15 bucks.
 
 
 
Go me!
 
😤
 

The issue with top players is that they can't sort out whether average strength of characters is better so they're running into more mid players with better tools than they used to. Because character parity is getting better, and mid level players are better equipped overall (say people like me running the cast rather than top players but at the top too), then the information you need to succeed becomes larger. That information is making games feel random. Funny enough when I tell people smaller casts are better and they flip, this is what I'm referring to.
 
The situation now too is far more perilous because a mid level player like me has significantly more, and better, practice. I'll have better understanding of match ups, I'll have more practice in them (because online got better), I'll have more access to higher end tech. The skill floor is a lot higher in some ends. That means that when a top player fucks up, they are really going to get railed hard. This wasn't necessarily the case before. Even when SRK was popping, the people who had access to the tech and access to a scene with enough quality players to prepare for match ups was a different issue. Justin is the King in MvC2, Justin also benefitted from being in a hyperbolic time chamber compared to the rest of the country in that game (this is not all dismissive of the GOAT by the way).
 
When it comes to Japan vs USA, there are some things that Japan does better overall. Had a homie who got stationed in Korea and got to play a lot of SF5 online over there. The way he talked about how "low level" players over there played compared to over here was wild. Before that though, Japan had a bigger edge in geography. The world vs Japan was really, for the most part, the world against Tokyo. Tokyo as a city had better facilities to get good at these games while having a higher concentration of players than a lot of the planet. For the older games, that meant a lot. Netplay has done a lot to make the world flourish (Japan included in this too, in respect to Strive, Verix won and the guy is from Africa...fucking wild times in FGs).
 
Yeah, older games are hard. But they're hard because they were trying to figure out how to make these things half the time. The other they were trying wild ideas which sometimes panned out, some times didn't. Games now a days are waaaay better designed overall than older ones. I love the old games too. But like Justin Wong told somebody in some interview: "In older games, a character just sucks because they have no way to combo into super." that situation doesn't really happen now a days.
 
Where things get really weird is when certain tools become too punishing that they warp situations. For better or worse, Marissa is a scrub's best friend. Marissa/Abigail/Etc type of design is basically built to carry people. They may not want to admit it in their souls, but it leads to more fraudulent wins than not. Zero in MvC3 was a career maker. Zero is easily the most fraudulent character in any VS game. There are people who got farther in tournaments playing this character than they probably had any right of doing. But hey, that's what we signed up for. Once a character can disproportionately do damage on common situations, real randomness happens. Marissa did 80% on a reversal, you got outplayed I guess.  Even in MvC2 if you still follow it, GeneralThrillah put in time with Iron Man/War Machine/Cable and grinded it out. But a lot of his wins were from random hit into 300%; that type of stuff is where things truly get random. We know there are people who are carried, we just don't talk about it. The FGC just don't have the vocabulary, insight or wisdom, to kinda talk about those things.
 
So there are a lot of factors. Drive Rush and Drive Parry are still big iffy mechanics. I don't know how you fix Drive Rush because it means reworking a lot of frame data. Don't know if you can fix drive parry at all TBH. But it can't possibly be that the games have gotten easier yet the same people are still on top.

What I'm saying is that a lot of "old heads" don't want to talk about how they took advantage of system things that were that way to make life easier for players. Increased throw invul frame is a direct contrast to SF2 where you could get dunked at times. Its dishonest to say the system is easier now when being able to fully wake up with hella defensive protection is something you can do in 3S.
 
There are things that are strong to the point of being scrubby in older games. Like bro, how much out playing is 3S Ken really doing? The guy has the best offense, best confirms from multiple buttons etc. Chun is even wilder. You think dudes are carried because the second half of the cast is strong than before? Chun beats 15 characters for free with 2 buttons: cr.mk and st.hp.
 
"Oh no modern games are so baby shit". Yeah, totally. The thing about MvC3 that made it baby shit was that the best zoner in the game couldn't do a full screen projectile on his incoming opponent, disable their ability to block by doing it and then ToD them from full screen. There's system stuff that sucked flaming ass in older games. People exploited it. It made the game harder for reasons that were, if we're being honest, actually bad.
 
I love these old games but they have flaws. Some of them were from design mechanics that didn't work as intended, other are glitches, etc. The way people talk about games in the FGC lacks so much nuance. There's too much of people talking about both sides of their mouth when it comes to system and design stuff.

I got to 23k LP last night in ranked and the competition is definitely getting tighter around this level for me.  I'm also running into quite a bit of chars I just don't have a lot of matchup knowledge against, like Ed, Lily, Kimberly, and Jamie.  When I win sets I'm finding myself winning more sets 2-1  now than 2-0 like I was before, which would put me on these pretty decent streaks of just gaining points.  But wining 2-1 is like a net of 60 points instead of 100+ and it's showing.  Or I will lose 1-2 as well.  I don't see myself losing too many 0-2 sets though so I guess that is good.

This whole podcast makes everybody here look like the worst type of smug asshole.
 
There's some level of zero self awareness from top FG players that's makes me not wanna be involved with the whole scene TBH.

This whole podcast makes everybody here look like the worst type of smug asshole.
 
There's some level of zero self awareness from top FG players that's makes me not wanna be involved with the whole scene TBH.

The issue with top players is that they can't sort out whether average strength of characters is better so they're running into more mid players with better tools than they used to. Because character parity is getting better, and mid level players are better equipped overall (say people like me running the cast rather than top players but at the top too), then the information you need to succeed becomes larger. That information is making games feel random. Funny enough when I tell people smaller casts are better and they flip, this is what I'm referring to.
 
The situation now too is far more perilous because a mid level player like me has significantly more, and better, practice. I'll have better understanding of match ups, I'll have more practice in them (because online got better), I'll have more access to higher end tech. The skill floor is a lot higher in some ends. That means that when a top player fucks up, they are really going to get railed hard. This wasn't necessarily the case before. Even when SRK was popping, the people who had access to the tech and access to a scene with enough quality players to prepare for match ups was a different issue. Justin is the King in MvC2, Justin also benefitted from being in a hyperbolic time chamber compared to the rest of the country in that game (this is not all dismissive of the GOAT by the way).
 
When it comes to Japan vs USA, there are some things that Japan does better overall. Had a homie who got stationed in Korea and got to play a lot of SF5 online over there. The way he talked about how "low level" players over there played compared to over here was wild. Before that though, Japan had a bigger edge in geography. The world vs Japan was really, for the most part, the world against Tokyo. Tokyo as a city had better facilities to get good at these games while having a higher concentration of players than a lot of the planet. For the older games, that meant a lot. Netplay has done a lot to make the world flourish (Japan included in this too, in respect to Strive, Verix won and the guy is from Africa...fucking wild times in FGs).
 
Yeah, older games are hard. But they're hard because they were trying to figure out how to make these things half the time. The other they were trying wild ideas which sometimes panned out, some times didn't. Games now a days are waaaay better designed overall than older ones. I love the old games too. But like Justin Wong told somebody in some interview: "In older games, a character just sucks because they have no way to combo into super." that situation doesn't really happen now a days.
 
Where things get really weird is when certain tools become too punishing that they warp situations. For better or worse, Marissa is a scrub's best friend. Marissa/Abigail/Etc type of design is basically built to carry people. They may not want to admit it in their souls, but it leads to more fraudulent wins than not. Zero in MvC3 was a career maker. Zero is easily the most fraudulent character in any VS game. There are people who got farther in tournaments playing this character than they probably had any right of doing. But hey, that's what we signed up for. Once a character can disproportionately do damage on common situations, real randomness happens. Marissa did 80% on a reversal, you got outplayed I guess.  Even in MvC2 if you still follow it, GeneralThrillah put in time with Iron Man/War Machine/Cable and grinded it out. But a lot of his wins were from random hit into 300%; that type of stuff is where things truly get random. We know there are people who are carried, we just don't talk about it. The FGC just don't have the vocabulary, insight or wisdom, to kinda talk about those things.
 
So there are a lot of factors. Drive Rush and Drive Parry are still big iffy mechanics. I don't know how you fix Drive Rush because it means reworking a lot of frame data. Don't know if you can fix drive parry at all TBH. But it can't possibly be that the games have gotten easier yet the same people are still on top.

The issue with top players is that they can't sort out whether average strength of characters is better so they're running into more mid players with better tools than they used to. Because character parity is getting better, and mid level players are better equipped overall (say people like me running the cast rather than top players but at the top too), then the information you need to succeed becomes larger. That information is making games feel random. Funny enough when I tell people smaller casts are better and they flip, this is what I'm referring to.
 
The situation now too is far more perilous because a mid level player like me has significantly more, and better, practice. I'll have better understanding of match ups, I'll have more practice in them (because online got better), I'll have more access to higher end tech. The skill floor is a lot higher in some ends. That means that when a top player fucks up, they are really going to get railed hard. This wasn't necessarily the case before. Even when SRK was popping, the people who had access to the tech and access to a scene with enough quality players to prepare for match ups was a different issue. Justin is the King in MvC2, Justin also benefitted from being in a hyperbolic time chamber compared to the rest of the country in that game (this is not all dismissive of the GOAT by the way).
 
When it comes to Japan vs USA, there are some things that Japan does better overall. Had a homie who got stationed in Korea and got to play a lot of SF5 online over there. The way he talked about how "low level" players over there played compared to over here was wild. Before that though, Japan had a bigger edge in geography. The world vs Japan was really, for the most part, the world against Tokyo. Tokyo as a city had better facilities to get good at these games while having a higher concentration of players than a lot of the planet. For the older games, that meant a lot. Netplay has done a lot to make the world flourish (Japan included in this too, in respect to Strive, Verix won and the guy is from Africa...fucking wild times in FGs).
 
Yeah, older games are hard. But they're hard because they were trying to figure out how to make these things half the time. The other they were trying wild ideas which sometimes panned out, some times didn't. Games now a days are waaaay better designed overall than older ones. I love the old games too. But like Justin Wong told somebody in some interview: "In older games, a character just sucks because they have no way to combo into super." that situation doesn't really happen now a days.
 
Where things get really weird is when certain tools become too punishing that they warp situations. For better or worse, Marissa is a scrub's best friend. Marissa/Abigail/Etc type of design is basically built to carry people. They may not want to admit it in their souls, but it leads to more fraudulent wins than not. Zero in MvC3 was a career maker. Zero is easily the most fraudulent character in any VS game. There are people who got farther in tournaments playing this character than they probably had any right of doing. But hey, that's what we signed up for. Once a character can disproportionately do damage on common situations, real randomness happens. Marissa did 80% on a reversal, you got outplayed I guess.  Even in MvC2 if you still follow it, GeneralThrillah put in time with Iron Man/War Machine/Cable and grinded it out. But a lot of his wins were from random hit into 300%; that type of stuff is where things truly get random. We know there are people who are carried, we just don't talk about it. The FGC just don't have the vocabulary, insight or wisdom, to kinda talk about those things.
 
So there are a lot of factors. Drive Rush and Drive Parry are still big iffy mechanics. I don't know how you fix Drive Rush because it means reworking a lot of frame data. Don't know if you can fix drive parry at all TBH. But it can't possibly be that the games have gotten easier yet the same people are still on top.