The Street Fighter V Thread

Vhozite · October 13, 2020

11 minutes ago, Darc_Requiem said:

@Vhozite Say what you will about their quality, but I feel that NRS gets the structure right. They make story around focused around a half dozen or so characters. Your ideas remind me of the best season of Agents of Shield. Season 4 of Agents of Shield was essentially three mini seasons. They had an 8 episode arc centered on Ghost Rider. 7 episode arc focused on LMDs (Life Model Decoys), and 7 episode arc that deal with The Framework (Agends of Hydra.). 22 episodes a no filler. Best 22 episode season I've seen of any show with that episode count period.

The idea is basically what I see reading books. One of the last books I read was Swan Song (by McCammon...wouldn’t recommend) and for the first 70% of the book there is like 3 different seemingly unrelated stories being told. They slowly tie it all together at the end, but since SF is an ongoing narrative you don’t really need to do that (or at least not force it).

Let the characters live their own lives.

Darc_Requiem · October 13, 2020

@VhoziteThat's what I tried to do when I wrote my book. Not sure how it turned out though.

Mattatsu · October 13, 2020

1 hour ago, KingTubb said:

Y'all have way more patients than I do for this stuff. Fighting game stories have always been kind of a chore for me.

I think they should do it the FromSoftware style where the story is told through context clues, limited cutscenes, and item descriptions.

If you wanna have a single player mode, at least give people the chance to add stat buffing items to the characters and give those items some relevance. SC does something like this, and I always thought SCs single player was pretty cool. SC6 has way to many cutscenes tho

I pretty much only do story modes if it unlocks stuff (but it has to be a game I’m invested in, as I straight up ignored DBFZ’s story even though it had character unlocks).

i will always watch MK stories (even if they didn’t have unlocks) just for personal nostalgia reasons.

also the MVCI story is great, in that it’s like a C-list action movie that’s so bad and cliche that it’s hilarious.

Volt · October 13, 2020

1 hour ago, KingTubb said:

Y'all have way more patients than I do for this stuff. Fighting game stories have always been kind of a chore for me.

I think they should do it the FromSoftware style where the story is told through context clues, limited cutscenes, and item descriptions.

If you wanna have a single player mode, at least give people the chance to add stat buffing items to the characters and give those items some relevance. SC does something like this, and I always thought SCs single player was pretty cool. SC6 has way to many cutscenes tho

That's a pretty awful idea.

The biggest problem of FGs is casual retention, so you need decent single player content to not just keep people interested in the series but also to entice people to actually drop 60/70 bucks on the base game.

Barebones releases like SFV, especially considering how bad the netcode is, immediately screw a game over.

And that's an already historically established franchise. Imagine smaller ones like Guilty Gear that doesn't have the mass appeal SF has.

A good story mode is a must, if only to stave off the dumb simplification of games to appeal to casuals.

Hawkingbird · October 13, 2020

I agree with @Hecatomthat Guilty Gear story is very straightforward. The issue with GG story is that it's presentation is terrible. I feel they didn't nail the presentation until Overture

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

Just now, Hawkingbird said:

I agree with @Hecatomthat Guilty Gear story is very straightforward. The issue with GG story is that it's presentation is terrible. I feel they didn't nail the presentation until Overture

I dont think it was terrible tbh.

Is just that until XX, the story was like any other story mode in fgs at the time, just some background text at the end of the arcade mode, with some animations/pics to acompany it.

The story modes on XX and AC were the usual VN fare, which i know is not for everyone, but due the limitations of the era, did sufice imo.

Darc_Requiem · October 13, 2020

Just in case anyone wants to see it, I dug up my old ME3 story arcs from....shit 8 years ago now. I was going to do more but I just stopped at Jacob and Miranda. It will give you a decent indication of my writing style. It really hasn't changed a lot since then.

KingTubb · October 13, 2020

42 minutes ago, Volt said:

decent single player content

Yeah, and I haven't played a modern fighter that has this.

42 minutes ago, Volt said:

A good story mode is a must

Exactly, I like the story and presentation of FromSoft games. I tried Xrd's, MVCi's, SFV's, UNIST's, BBCF, T7's story modes and I think they're wack. It's usually just an arcade mode with a whole bunch of cutscenes thrown in. A lot of the time, you don't even get to pick your character, and you spend a big chunk of your time just watching a cutscene.

SC6 and DBFZ is a little bit better imho because at least it give you the option of what you're going to do next, and you get to pick your characters (eventually in DBFZ) and it tries to be something more than a bloated arcade mode.

42 minutes ago, Volt said:

And that's an already historically established franchise. Imagine smaller ones like Guilty Gear that doesn't have the mass appeal SF has.

But all of these games, regardless of player base, are long running franchises with long running stories. I honestly feel like the story modes in fighting games are more for the fans of the franchise than the new-comer casuals. Imagine being someone who just picked up Xrd cause the box art was cool and it was on sale and trying to play it. You'd have no clue what was going on.

Everyone I know that's even familiar with video games knows what Street Fighter is. Outside of FGC people, none of them know what Shadaloo or what Satsui No Hado is.

Edit: Imma add a little anecdote from a friend of mine. He's a T7 casual, played a lot of tekken 3, 5 and tekken tag growing up. Loved the story in 3 and 5, picked up 7 just to play the story mode and he had no idea what was going on, was bored to tears, and had a miserable time trying to beat Akuma and Devil

Edited October 13, 2020 by KingTubb

BornWinner · October 13, 2020

Giovanna’s a true Brazilian because she turns green, just like Brazilian hero, Blanka.

Edited October 13, 2020 by BornWinner

Sonero · October 13, 2020

@Volta

Approves of the message above.

😤

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

31 minutes ago, KingTubb said:

But all of these games, regardless of player base, are long running franchises with long running stories. I honestly feel like the story modes in fighting games are more for the fans of the franchise than the new-comer casuals. Imagine being someone who just picked up Xrd cause the box art was cool and it was on sale and trying to play it. You'd have no clue what was going on.

Well, duhhhh.

Like you said, they are long running franchises.

Expecting to be able to tell what is happening on a sequel without watching or knowing the old entries is ludicrous.

Is like never watching any of the MCU movies and then watching just Infinity War expecting to know who the chars are, or why they are doing the stuff they are doing.

Also, lol wut?

The story modes of UNI and GGXrd are not glorified arcade modes.

UNI is a visual novel, where you select the chapter for each character.

Xrd is a full on visual novel with cinematics that doesnt even have fights at all.

Are you sure you played the story modes, or did you just selected arcade mode thinking those were the story modes?

Serious question.

Mattatsu · October 13, 2020

Tbh, GG being a complete movie with no interaction was terrible for someone who doesn’t know anything about GG. I watched that for 5 minutes before having the best nap on my couch I’ve ever had

KingTubb · October 13, 2020

11 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

Well, duhhhh.

Like you said, they are long running franchises.

Expecting to be able to tell what is happening on a sequel without watching or knowing the old entries is ludicrous.

Exactly. I thought Volt was trying to say that story modes are important for bringing in newcomers or casuals. If I'm wrong, sorry Volt.

11 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

The story modes of UNI and GGXrd are not glorified arcade modes.

Yeah, I know, homie. I was generalizing. I listed like 7 games, and most of them are "Cutscene, fight once, Cutscene, repeat" which is how UNI works, but I appreciate it more than T7's story mode cause it's in a VN format, I can read faster than they talk, and it's quick and snappy. I actually think UNI's story mode is one of the better ones, I'm just not that crazy about the story it tells.

Xrd just being a movie pissed me off so bad I never got through it 🤣

Edited October 13, 2020 by KingTubb

Shakunetsu · October 13, 2020

Another problem with SFV cinematic mode is that it is too long that people who already finished it already would not bother to pick it up again and would probably play it after the next two months or so. And the reason people cinematic mode is for the insights and particular information that they probably just missed in the first playthrough not because of it being a great mode in SFV.

The standard arcade mode in the previous was more straight forward for the bit of information that people needed and SFV's new version of Arcade mode have more replay value and engagement than the cinematic mode.

Some would just look into wiki, gamefaqs or even just watch it on video sites and fast forward to a particular spot that they think they missed an information about a character that was already known this is why I liked it more to be more focused on new character while some returning character detail isn't very focused other than their participation in the conflict or event.

This is also why I like the stories to be individual short stories that intertwine to each other not long stories that is separated by multiple continuous chapters.

KingTubb · October 13, 2020

5 minutes ago, Mattatsu said:

I watched that for 5 minutes before having the best nap on my couch I’ve ever had

You're a more reasonable person than me. realized it was just cutscenes and rage quit

Shakunetsu · October 13, 2020

If Capcom can't let go of the story centered on Ryu and Shadaloo or Bison again as the main villain.

It might as well make it a retell of the previous story in a separate cinematic mode that is history centered of history mode something. If they believe fans still doesn't know street fighter characters backstory or If they believe fans still wants the story revolves the same of way of Ryu and Bison.

That's better than continuously making new future stories variation of the same thing that is Ryu vs the main villain or Bison to be beaten by Ry in a different and separate settings that is redundant even it a whole new story.

Mattatsu · October 13, 2020

6 minutes ago, KingTubb said:

You're a more reasonable person than me. realized it was just cutscenes and rage quit

Dude, you missed out on an awesome nap 🤣

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

8 minutes ago, KingTubb said:

Exactly. I thought Volt was trying to say that story modes are important for bringing in newcomers or casuals. If I'm wrong, sorry Volt.

Yeah, I know, homie. I was generalizing. I listed like 7 games, and most of them are "Cutscene, fight once, Cutscene, repeat" which is how UNI works, but I appreciate it more than T7's story mode cause it's in a VN format, I can read faster than they talk, and it's quick and snappy. I actually think UNI's story mode is one of the better ones, I'm just not that crazy about the story it tells.

Xrd just being a movie pissed me off so bad I never got through it 🤣

I wouldnt defend the quakity of the story of Xrd because honestly, i didnt like it much like the ones on XX, everything boiled down to the power of friendship.

But i felt it was a nice try to have something that tried to tell an story, instead of tryin to have sime contrived nonsense story trying to force fights like ither story modes.

Of the recent tory mides the one i liked the most was the GBFVS one, not necessarily because the stiry, byt because it was an engaging game mode.

With more polish it could be its own thing in the vein of vanillaware games.

Chun-Li_Forever · October 13, 2020

4 minutes ago, Shakunetsu said:

If Capcom can't let go of the story centered on Ryu and Shadaloo or Bison again as the main villain.

It might as well make it a retell of the previous story in a separate cinematic mode that is history centered of history mode something. If they believe fans still doesn't know street fighter characters backstory or If they believe fans still wants the story revolves the same of way of Ryu and Bison.

That's better than continuously making new future stories variation of the same thing that is Ryu vs the main villain or Bison to be beaten by Ry in a different and separate settings that is redundant even it a whole new story.

I still contend that Chun-Li deserved that final fight against M. Bison more than Ryu, or anyone else. It would've been a perfect book-end to her "revenge" arc before opening the "motherhood" chapter of her life with Li-Fen.

Btut SFIII was in the right direction with the MC being Alex and the main baddies being the Illuminati and Urien/Gill.

KingTubb · October 13, 2020

5 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

felt it was a nice try to have something that tried to tell an story, instead of tryin to have sime contrived nonsense story trying to force fights like ither story modes.

Word. There should be an engaging single player mode that's incredibly light on story, non-cannon, or story-less that's actually fun to play and keep the story people happy with a collection of cutscenes like xrd.

For example, VF4 Evo was 4th wall breaking and sorta meta, but I heard the single player in that game is super cool and engaging

FlyingVe · October 13, 2020

Seeing as I was invited here I feel compelled to contribute.

one of my favorite FG plots is BlazBlue CT (and only CT).

it has a scenario where every character can have an honest motivation and the time loop premise means that “everything” can be cannon and the narrative doesn’t need to force fights at as unreasonable a pace.

it is very wordy though.

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

2 hours ago, Volt said:

That's a pretty awful idea.

The biggest problem of FGs is casual retention, so you need decent single player content to not just keep people interested in the series but also to entice people to actually drop 60/70 bucks on the base game.

Barebones releases like SFV, especially considering how bad the netcode is, immediately screw a game over.

And that's an already historically established franchise. Imagine smaller ones like Guilty Gear that doesn't have the mass appeal SF has.

A good story mode is a must, if only to stave off the dumb simplification of games to appeal to casuals.

Every game loses its casual player base.

It is why they are casuals.

They buy the game, play it for a while and move on.

The problem with player retention in fgs is not exclussive to it, neither the percentages.

Take Destiny 2 for example.

Is a game that moved plenty of millions of units , but its active player base is between 200k to 400k.

It only seems as a problem because fgs are a niche genre due the intrinsic nature of the genre.

The core of the experience is fighting against other players, and since you dont have teammates to carry you, every lose is either internalized into your own abbilities and willingness to improve ir just leave the game, or externalize that the game sucks, or only tryhards or cheaters and other scrubby shit.

Eithet way, if they dont really have the interest on the genre, they will leave.

Single player content cant change that fact, no matter how much they invest into having multitude of modes.

Look at MK and Inj for example, they sell millions, yet have the worst player retention ratio than most because most people buy it, play the story, some single player modes, maybe some online matches and then leave to their preferd day to day fps.

I have many friends that do that.

And is freaking hilarious because they say they love MK, but never want to play onlibe because they are on Overwatch, Cod, Destiny, etc.

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

25 minutes ago, KingTubb said:

Word. There should be an engaging single player mode that's incredibly light on story, non-cannon, or story-less that's actually fun to play and keep the story people happy with a collection of cutscenes like xrd.

For example, VF4 Evo was 4th wall breaking and sorta meta, but I heard the single player in that game is super cool and engaging

The single player mode iirc is just you going to arcades and olaying with "other" players.

It was fine at the time, but on this day with online modes it would be panned.

Shakunetsu · October 13, 2020

22 minutes ago, Chun-Li_Forever said:

I still contend that Chun-Li deserved that final fight against M. Bison more than Ryu, or anyone else. It would've been a perfect book-end to her "revenge" arc before opening the "motherhood" chapter of her life with Li-Fen.

I believe they should have gang up against him and out numbered Bison which was supposed to be what Guile should have done.

Bison is a dangerous person not just some personal acquaintance of anybody there that needed a score to settle and they need to TOOK TURNS.

It's terrible specially especially Guile after seeing Nash die and still watch. It's emotion less and has no value other than SETTING the stage for RYU and Bison. It's an obvious staged and UNNATURAL No rage and Bison ends up person trying to seek validation to Ryu rather than being confident to his means and straight forward to his goals.

The only way Bison is talking because he is bragging and unknowing what kind of person he is in those different universe story.

That's why this is better(Sf4 Aftermath Viper) it feels that it's natural that those characters do that. Since Bison is not a personal thing but known world threat to everyone present in that event.

This is why Rugal is miles ahead than SFV's Bison because he doesn't fanboying to Kyo like Iori is. Same does Geese to Terry

Atleast in that Viper aftermath video Bison has the Rugal vibe being that doesn't felt especially being defeated by the protagonist.

Akuma to Ryu while other trying to distance would make sense because it is personal not a global threat like with Bison.

And this one is amazing.

They are up against unfamiliar individuals that is strong and they need to fight with what ever it takes not about individual cause or not talking too much like SFV Bison did.

Imagine that if Nash and Guile would be fighting together.

Vega/Claw was also a meh that did nothing and move away.

Edited October 13, 2020 by Shakunetsu

Volt · October 13, 2020

26 minutes ago, Shakunetsu said:

SFV's new version of Arcade mode have more replay value and engagement than the cinematic mode.

Bruh.

We need a Story Scrubquotes.

This is a bonkers trend I see on the FGC, instead of actually improving on story content and storytelling methods, people want to hustle backwards.

The biggest problem with SFV's cinematic story was that it had dogshit writing. The medium is fine.

Similarly, the Arcade Mode was dogshit because over 70% of the endings were either non-canon or straight up irrelevant.

19 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

I wouldnt defend the quakity of the story of Xrd because honestly, i didnt like it much like the ones on XX, everything boiled down to the power of friendship.

But i felt it was a nice try to have something that tried to tell an story, instead of tryin to have sime contrived nonsense story trying to force fights like ither story modes.

Ngl, I didn't mind the actual content of the story because we can't ignore that a lot of the conflicts in the story were solved in AC+ and Overture.

But my point was really about the structure.

Xrd got a great structure going on.

Let's wait and see what Strive brings to the table.

24 minutes ago, KingTubb said:

Word. There should be an engaging single player mode that's incredibly light on story, non-cannon, or story-less that's actually fun to play and keep the story people happy with a collection of cutscenes like xrd.

There are plenty of options.

Something that lets you stack buffs working like a survival mode was pretty much what Abyss was iirc. I think GGs Survival Mode was like this too.

Plain old survival is solid too. Arcade also has mad replayability. Some kind of Boss Rush like the ArcSys Score Attack modes are also viable options.

Story is just a foundation, but in terms of SP content there's a lot of potential.

Shakunetsu · October 13, 2020

I'm just comparing it for the replay value of the current cinematic mode to the other Arcade Mode and why people don't play it again as often as that mode. It's not about the other one being a better storymode but rather does a better appeal to be played again to casual and fans.

If they want a better story it's always about being insightful and new that's what I believe into.

Edited October 13, 2020 by Shakunetsu

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

28 minutes ago, KingTubb said:

Word. There should be an engaging single player mode that's incredibly light on story, non-cannon, or story-less that's actually fun to play and keep the story people happy with a collection of cutscenes like xrd.

For example, VF4 Evo was 4th wall breaking and sorta meta, but I heard the single player in that game is super cool and engaging

The problem is that niggas dont know what they want.

Those cinematic and extensive story modes are the result of every fucker complaining of fgs having bare minimum stories.

Now that they got what they asked you have niggas complaining that they are too long, etc etc.

And now are asking to go back to what they said they hated.

Is fucking bonkers.

I personally think that story modes are a waste of resources, since the meat of the game is playing against people.

But i am also aware that they are needed to drice sales fir those who care for that shit or just like the chars and like the world but dont want to play people.

At the end of the day, it doesnt matter what they do, no one will ever be pleased.

Because everyone has their own idea of it should have been done, regardless if it even make sense or not.

Story modes are not for actual fgs players, they are for casuals.

And many go apeshit when their single pkayer content can be finished in less than 4 hours.

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

Just now, Shakunetsu said:

I'm just comparing it for the replay value of the current cinematic mode and why people don't play it again as often as that mode. It's not about the other one being a better storymode but rather does a better appeal to be played again to casual and fans.

If they want a better story it's always about being insightful and new that's what I believe into.

The replay value of an story mode that is static and usually doesnt have branches for multiple endings will always be minimal, no matter the genre.

Story modes are just a fluff.

And shouldnt be the focus of single player content with replayability.

KingTubb · October 13, 2020

9 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

It was fine at the time, but on this day with online modes it would be panned.

I dunno, homie, I think it could be cool. You have a create an character that you get to run around Tokyo with. You have a lot of NPCs that you get to interact with. For example, one guy will only let you into the arcade that has the next "boss" in it if you get him his favorite ramen from a restaurant across town. So you have to hustle kids to get the money to pay for it, get the ramen, bring it to him, etc, etc.

It would be like P5 with virtua fighter. you could even have dialogue trees and "trust meters" where people will give you tips or buffs for helping them. Like one kid at an arcade is getting bullied, so you whoop whoever's bullying him's ass and he tells you the next boss loves to throw and if you tech backwards, it always works. It could be cool

Shakunetsu · October 13, 2020

Just now, Hecatom said:

The replay value of an story mode that is static and usually doesnt have branches for multiple endings will always be minimal, no matter the genre.

Story modes are just a fluff.

And shouldnt be the focus of single player content with replayability.

Agree and also I'm not one of those people that are wanting a cinematic mode like that

and I'm more into CVS2 arcade mode style since SF4.

Probably a FMV endings with intertwining stories would do better.

Edited October 13, 2020 by Shakunetsu

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

27 minutes ago, Volt said:

Bruh.

We need a Story Scrubquotes.

This is a bonkers trend I see on the FGC, instead of actually improving on story content and storytelling methods, people want to hustle backwards.

The biggest problem with SFV's cinematic story was that it had dogshit writing. The medium is fine.

Similarly, the Arcade Mode was dogshit because over 70% of the endings were either non-canon or straight up irrelevant.

Ngl, I didn't mind the actual content of the story because we can't ignore that a lot of the conflicts in the story were solved in AC+ and Overture.

But my point was really about the structure.

Xrd got a great structure going on.

Let's wait and see what Strive brings to the table.

There are plenty of options.

Something that lets you stack buffs working like a survival mode was pretty much what Abyss was iirc. I think GGs Survival Mode was like this too.

Plain old survival is solid too. Arcade also has mad replayability. Some kind of Boss Rush like the ArcSys Score Attack modes are also viable options.

Story is just a foundation, but in terms of SP content there's a lot of potential.

A good sp mode that could work is like what GG Isuka, GG Judgement and GBFVS have, a beatem up/rpg, where you have side stories and can have fun beating npcs created for the mode.

Even better if you can play it online.

You could even have some degree of customization where you improve sp moves and even select which ones fir the char to have.

Like you can only equip some some of the moves.

Edited October 13, 2020 by Hecatom

Volt · October 13, 2020

17 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

Every game loses its casual player base.

It is why they are casuals.

They buy the game, play it for a while and move on.

The problem with player retention in fgs is not exclussive to it, neither the percentages.

Take Destiny 2 for example.

Is a game that moved plenty of millions of units , but its active player base is between 200k to 400k.

It only seems as a problem because fgs are a niche genre due the intrinsic nature of the genre.

The core of the experience is fighting against other players, and since you dont have teammates to carry you, every lose is either internalized into your own abbilities and willingness to improve ir just leave the game, or externalize that the game sucks, or only tryhards or cheaters and other scrubby shit.

Eithet way, if they dont really have the interest on the genre, they will leave.

Single player content cant change that fact, no matter how much they invest into having multitude of modes.

Look at MK and Inj for example, they sell millions, yet have the worst player retention ratio than most because most people buy it, play the story, some single player modes, maybe some online matches and then leave to their preferd day to day fps.

I have many friends that do that.

And is freaking hilarious because they say they love MK, but never want to play onlibe because they are on Overwatch, Cod, Destiny, etc.

It's something that can't be helped. Some people just don't have that mindset.

I kinda chose the wrong term too, some retention is important for numbers because otherwise bitches start memeing about "lol ded game" until it's a Discord Fighter.

On the other hand, they did buy the game, if only to play the single player content.

This is actually good for the devs because they're making more paper and getting bigger numbers and brand recognition.

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

2 minutes ago, Shakunetsu said:

Agree and also I'm not one of those people that are wanting a cinematic mode like that

and I'm more into CVS2 arcade mode style since SF4.

Probably a FMV endings with intertwining stories would do better.

And that is why the games also have arcade modes with endings at tje end.

The cinematic story is not for you, is for the casuals that boost the sales and then leave.

Not everything in the game is tailored for everyone.

Chun-Li_Forever · October 13, 2020

12 minutes ago, Shakunetsu said:

I believe they should have gang up against him and out numbered Bison which was supposed to be what Guile should have done.

Bison is a dangerous person not just some personal acquaintance of anybody there that needed a score to settle and they need to TOOK TURNS.

It's terrible specially especially Guile after seeing Nash die and still watch. It's emotion less and has no value other than SETTING the stage for RYU and Bison. It's an obvious staged and UNNATURAL No rage and Bison ends up person trying to seek validation to Ryu rather than being confident to his means and straight forward to his goals.

The only way Bison is talking because he is bragging and unknowing what kind of person he is in those different universe story.

That's why this is better(Sf4 Aftermath Viper) it feels that it's natural that those characters do that. Since Bison is not a personal thing but known world threat to everyone present in that event.

This is why Rugal is miles ahead than SFV's Bison because he doesn't fanboying to Kyo like Iori is. Same does Geese to Terry

Atleast in that Viper aftermath video Bison has the Rugal vibe being that doesn't felt especially being defeated by the protagonist.

Akuma to Ryu while other trying to distance would make sense because it is personal not a global threat like with Bison.

And this one is amazing.

They are up against unfamiliar individuals that is strong and they need to fight with what ever it takes not about individual cause or not talking too much like SFV Bison did.

Imagine that if Nash and Guile would be fighting together.

Vega/Claw was also a meh that did nothing and move away.

Fair arguements.

I do agree with you that the fight should've been a ganged-up fight. M. Bison is already powerful enough, but adding the power he got from the black moons, he's was pretty much a borderline God. However, i don't think that's any excuse for the writers to let someone completely random like Ryu be the one to have the last fight. It's only fitting that the one with the most investment against Shadaloo should be the ones to finish it.

Here's what I would've done. Combining The4thSnake's video, with your idea, I would've had Nash, Guile, and Chun-Li (maybe Ryu) all attack M. Bison, but he's too strong, too powerful, and easily overwhelms them. Nash makes the noble sacrifice to drain M. Bison as much as he can to weaken him. Nash lays in Guile's arms, finally bringing closure for Guile (and would somewhat enforce his SFV Arcade Mode ending). But that sets it up for one last battle for Chun-Li.

Even though he's weakened, It's still a hard fight for Chun-Li, but she barely pulls it out at the end. And I think this is the pivotal moment for her. She's finally at hand to end Bison once and for all and avenge her father. But at the same time, Chun-Li sees Li-Fen is in danger (either held hostage by FANG or something). This is a character moment for Chun as she chooses to let Bison for somethign greater than revenge.

As Bison escapes, he is "devoured" by a Necalli, and Ryu has to use his newfound Power of Nothingness to stop the beast before he wrecks havoc on the world, That way, (and if set and wrtten well in the begining), Necalli won't have to resort to just being a random jobber for most of A Shadow Falls.

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

1 minute ago, Volt said:

It's something that can't be helped. Some people just don't have that mindset.

I kinda chose the wrong term too, some retention is important for numbers because otherwise bitches start memeing about "lol ded game" until it's a Discord Fighter.

On the other hand, they did buy the game, if only to play the single player content.

This is actually good for the devs because they're making more paper and getting bigger numbers and brand recognition.

Nigga, people call overwatch a dead game.

By their definition even the bigger fgs are dead

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

10 minutes ago, KingTubb said:

I dunno, homie, I think it could be cool. You have a create an character that you get to run around Tokyo with. You have a lot of NPCs that you get to interact with. For example, one guy will only let you into the arcade that has the next "boss" in it if you get him his favorite ramen from a restaurant across town. So you have to hustle kids to get the money to pay for it, get the ramen, bring it to him, etc, etc.

It would be like P5 with virtua fighter. you could even have dialogue trees and "trust meters" where people will give you tips or buffs for helping them. Like one kid at an arcade is getting bullied, so you whoop whoever's bullying him's ass and he tells you the next boss loves to throw and if you tech backwards, it always works. It could be cool

Maybe, but that was not what that mode was, you only had menus to travel to different arcade centers, entered and played against ghost data from players, supposedly.

And while i see the appeal of an rpg lite, it is at the end of the day another venture that will take resources awa of the actual meat of the game, and that its appeal will only last a while.

The thing is that the more extensive those modes are, the less resources are focused on the fg component, which is the whole point of the game.

Volt · October 13, 2020

7 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

You could even have some degree of customization where you improve sp moves and even select which ones fir the char to have.

The DS GG spinoff had a customizable Robo-Ky that you could unlock and assign specials to.

It's just some cool stuff to shake things up from the cycle of "Training -> Matches -> Replays -> Repeat".

Besides, catering to more people and getting more sales without having to dumb down the game is a good thing for everyone.

Doctrine_Dark · October 13, 2020

Thought it was interesting how SNK changed their Story Mode format from KOF13 to KOF14. In KOF13, there was a Story Mode (that I really enjoyed, since there were different paths based on the team you selected) and an Arcade Mode with endings. In KOF14, the Story Mode was basically changed to your usual Arcade Mode with endings. This was repeated in SamSho as well.

I wonder how SNK is going to handle KOF15.

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

16 minutes ago, Volt said:

The DS GG spinoff had a customizable Robo-Ky that you could unlock and assign specials to.

It's just some cool stuff to shake things up from the cycle of "Training -> Matches -> Replays -> Repeat".

Besides, catering to more people and getting more sales without having to dumb down the game is a good thing for everyone.

GG Isuka was the game that introduced the Robo Ky mk2, it was a nice addition, but you could see his animations were on the low budget end when compared to the rest of the cast, lol.

At the end of the day i think that there is kind of a limit on how much sp you can add to fgs due the core of them and how limited they are to branch into more stuff without ending doing new games within the game.

Volt · October 13, 2020

4 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

At the end of the day i think that there is kind of a limit on how much sp you can add to fgs due the core of them and how limited they are to branch into more stuff without ending doing new games within the game.

Overture kinda messed up on that front. Tried too much stuff and wound up having too little of everything.

But yeah, we're clearly talking about bells and whistles here, not the actual rice and beans.

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

17 minutes ago, Volt said:

Overture kinda messed up on that front. Tried too much stuff and wound up having too little of everything.

But yeah, we're clearly talking about bells and whistles here, not the actual rice and beans.

I am not really sure what you meant about that.

I actually liked Overture, and think that with some refinement the game culd end being a great vehicle for the franchise to breach into a moba like type of game.

I actually think the gameplay was kind of ahead of its time, and also was held by being a 360 exclussive.

It has aged kind of bad in certain areas like graphics and some animations, but its core gameplay is interesting and fun, imo.

Shakunetsu · October 13, 2020

Some might confuse me for someone who like lengthy cinematic mode since I'm always in storythreads.

What I am concern is more on coherence, detail, depth, character not acting out of character being consistent and traditional to what they are in 90s.

That's why i'm into story should be more focus to new characters and not so long

I was more concern on playability and just important details with the characters and not some FMV

Initial before SFV cinematic mode was previewed but mentioned here are my request in SFV for gameplay features.

https://forums.shoryuken.com/t/final-features-gameplay-improvements-list-for-capcom-sent-to-capcom-combofiend/181187/74

43 minutes ago, Shakunetsu said:

Is this possible? I made a non-game breaking stuff for the Story Mode modes or the possible upcoming mode.

Story Mode Suggestions:

I did a concept that enhance the Story Mode by merging great ideas from World Tour to work as one without the complication and bringing out the best of the best. It’s like Story Mode with a randomized Daily Challenges that works in random but the challenges are alike World Tour.

Since the SF’s story mode that cannot offer random encounters like normal RPG, I have a idea for it to have* random match requirements and random CPU power Ups* that shift and changes per new battle/round that need to be full filled inspired from on SF3 World tour mode. Per battle has a randomized Battle Type Mode that is paired with either Battle Challenge or Battle Attack Mode, I have separated SFZ3’s Battles types to avoid Battle Challenge and Battle Attack to work in simultaneously because they can get *conflicted with each *other when rumbled and randomized together.

As the difficulty of Story mode increases the number of Battle type and Battle Attack that can activate in a match period.

The Battle Types: a random CPU Power Up that can be one to all battle type mode can simultaneously activate in a match.
Sample of Battle Type Mode:

Stun/Stamina max(enemy has no stun)

Ex-gauge max(enemy has infinite)

V-Trigger max(enemy has infinite)

Survival (your previous vitality left will be carried over the next match)

Battle Challenge: Battle requirement on beating the match, Only one challenge is activated in a match.
Sample Battle Challenge Mode for SFV:

Beat the match in V-Trigger mode or move,

Use no V-Trigger/V-Skill/Grab/Special/Ex/Super in the whole match

Beat the match with Ex-move/special move/Super/Normal/Grab/Crush Counter/Time over

Time attack(beat the match in limited time)

Battle Attack : a random CPU Power Up that can simultaneously activate up to 4 battle attack mode in a match.
Sample of Battle Attack Mode:

Throw Attack(Throw would only damage)

Super Attack(Only super move will damage)

Combo Attack(Only combo will damage)

EX Attack(Only Ex attacks will damage)

Combo Attack(Only 2nd hit will confirm as damage)

Special Attack(Only special move will damage)

20-40-60% CPU vitality indestructibility. (Time Over Battle)

Battle Bonus: Gives you power ups or rewards upon full filling challenges and meeting the requirements this was done by Street Fighter EX2’s bonus stages like beating cycloids and satellites, It’s also in the early SNK games like Art of Fighting series where after beating a certain in-between bonus stages would give you a decent power up.

Sample of Power-Up/Reward for Battle Bonuses Events:

Full meter V-gauge next match!

Full meter Ex-gauge next match!

50% meter Ex-gauge next match!

50% meter V-gauge next match!

Vitality Increase 30% (For Survival Battle Type only).

Arcade Mode Concepts

Arcade Mode Plot - I made a rough draft concept of a possible Arcade Mode with the same timeline because it will be a loosely interpretation of the Cinematic Mode so it won’t bring complication and misunderstanding because it’s from the same timeline but mostly every random or predestined encounters and confrontations in this mode are based on what if events.
Bonus Features - I would also like to add a game mechanic that is embedded in all matches in Arcade Mode that works very similar to KOF 13’s system called Target Actions because it’s like a mini quest within Arcade matches that will add fun factor much more.

Random Select Modes - Variance of play style for random Select works also in online matches.

Twelve Mode : Tribute and work’s similar Marionette in Vampire Savior Mirror Matches

Eleven Mode : Tribute and work’s similar Shadow in Vampire Savior Transform into previous enemy.

Shadaloo Holo Mode I : Tribute and similar work in SFEX that random change of character per every match.

Shadaloo Holo Mode II : Tribute and similar work in SFEX that random change of character per every round.

Target Action: (A Similar System)
"<n>" = is a randomized number 3 to 5

Perform <n> number of jumps.

Successfully block <n> number of hits.

Successfully land a <n> combo hits.

Hit (block or unblock) your opponent with <n> Normals

Hit (block or unblock) your opponent with <n> Special Moves

Do <n> number of dashes.

Do <n> number of V-Skill.

Functionality: Differ from KOF 13’s Target Actions.

Every random task expires within 10 seconds and will be replace by a newer one.

Each succession rewards you with a random 5,10,15 and 20 percent fill up of the full 100% of the EX-Gauge.

After succession will be given a another new task.

Does not give V-Gauge bonuses

Sample Task: appearance on screen.

Perform 5 number of jumps.

Bonus 10% UP in EX-gauge.

Arcade Matches Flow

The Arcade Mode takes the best system of SF3s like choosing destination and CVS2’s secret boss system.

5 random characters

Mid Boss/Secret Challenger

Q as a default bonus like lance/knight in fighting layer.

Twelve Mode: Mirror Match

Mini Survival Match with 3 rounds but one life gauge against 3 random dolls

Boss fight

Secret Bosses…

Secret Challenger/Mid Bosses - typical anti-heroes

Necalli

Juri

Viper

Nash

Default Boss - is Fang powered up version( Unli or Max V Trigger and Ex-Gauge)

Secret Bosses - are like condition of God Rugal and Shin Akuma in CVS2 or Athena and Red Admerer in SVC Chaos

Bison (Unli or Max V-Trigger and Ex-Gauge) - why? to reveal that he will come back but not to emphasize his defeat from finishing the mode.

Urien (Unli or Max V-Trigger and Ex-Gauge) - where? he is somewhere exploring the whereabouts of Shadaloo or SIN laboratory Experiments

Every Infinite or Maxed out V-gauge and EX-gauge for Default boss, Secret bosses and Secret Challengers.

Overall 10 battles… together with Secret boss and Secret challengers

Endings would in general and be just arts like MVC2 for default boss fight

Endings for Secret Boss fight have art and texts information about past activities of Shadaloo or Illuminati depending whom is confronted either Urien or Bison.

It’s not to move forward* other than a loosely based story mode that is turned into a arcade mode that would reveal bison did still exist after the story mode events and their is another threat organization that is unknown.

I like World Tour and CVS2 which was the initial inspiration on that request.

I was hoping it was more like World Tour with ending not a movie thing.

This was more like a QUEST MODE like in VF and SOUL Series merge with world tour and cvs2 arcade mode.

Volt · October 13, 2020

23 minutes ago, Hecatom said:

I am not really sure what you meant about that.

I actually liked Overture, and think that with some refinement the game culd end being a great vehicle for the franchise to breach into a moba like type of game.

I actually think the gameplay was kind of ahead of its time, and also was held by being a 360 exclussive.

It has aged kind of bad in certain areas like graphics and some animations, but its core gameplay is interesting and fun, imo.

Oh, don't get me wrong, Overture is sick af, but it definitely needed a bit more polish.

But what I meant is that Overture doesn't really captalize on some of its coolest points.

The combat is sick, but there's no game mode where you can just do Master vs Master battles in smaller arenas.

That mission with Ky having to defend Illyria's castle gates from a horde of enemies with some brainwashed ones you need to stun and recruit definitely had a lot of potential, but it's just one mission.

That game was *great*, it just needs some refinements and more characters.

Illwill88 · October 13, 2020

Fighting games are kind of inherently bad for story modes. You can't really do like other games because there's no main character or allow created characters.

I would like to see developers do a story that's separate like a rpg, or the mk game where you played like a co-op game where you did combos together and shit . Then the regular fighting game is separate with online, training mode etc etc.

At the end of the day the standard fighting game doesn't have enough content for casuals. MK is the only one off the top of my head that does. I'm well aware they have the team and budget to do it. Johnny casual doesnt want to spend full price on a game to only have a half ass arcade mode and online so he can get shit on all day.

Darc_Requiem · October 13, 2020

2 hours ago, FlyingVe said:

Seeing as I was invited here I feel compelled to contribute.

one of my favorite FG plots is BlazBlue CT (and only CT).

it has a scenario where every character can have an honest motivation and the time loop premise means that “everything” can be cannon and the narrative doesn’t need to force fights at as unreasonable a pace.

it is very wordy though.

Darc_Requiem · October 13, 2020

3 hours ago, BornWinner said:

Giovanna’s a true Brazilian because she turns green, just like Brazilian hero, Blanka.

Spoiler

Don't tell @Volt(sees the reactions...) too late 😔

Hecatom · October 13, 2020

36 minutes ago, Shakunetsu said:

Some might confuse me for someone who like lengthy cinematic mode since I'm always in storythreads.

What I am concern is more on coherence, detail, depth, character not acting out of character being consistent and traditional to what they are in 90s.

That's why i'm into story should be more focus to new characters and not so long

I was more concern on playability and just important details with the characters and not some FMV

Initial before SFV cinematic mode was previewed but mentioned here are my request in SFV for gameplay features.

https://forums.shoryuken.com/t/final-features-gameplay-improvements-list-for-capcom-sent-to-capcom-combofiend/181187/74

I like World Tour and CVS2 which was the initial inspiration on that request.

I was hoping it was more like World Tour with ending not a movie thing.

This was more like a QUEST MODE like in VF and SOUL Series merge with world tour and cvs2 arcade mode.

I understand your desire, but the problem with that kind of mode is that forces and limits even more what the devs can do with an story mode.

If said mode only allows you to lay against other chars in the roster, its story potential is squanded even more, because now you have a glorified arcade mode with just cinematics/pictures/scenes sprinkled between some fights to justify why everyone is fighting.

If people want a good story and a well explored world and chars, fgs are not the vehicle for that.

At least not, if you also want to keep the core of the experience tied to just the fgs experience.

SoulCalibur has the advantage of having a CAS mode that allows it more freedom to not tie the experience to just the core cast, but even with that advantage, is still reduced to havin a glorified arcade mode with story bits sprinkled beatween each fight.

And like i said, while Quest mode was an interesting addition back in the day, on todays context it will be seen as a copout since you can do what it simulates by just playing online.

At the end of the day, imo, story modes are just fluff.

And if people really wants a fleshed story, that is why we have side media for.

TWINBLADES · October 13, 2020

2 hours ago, Hecatom said:

The problem is that niggas dont know what they want.

Those cinematic and extensive story modes are the result of every fucker complaining of fgs having bare minimum stories.

I know what I want fuck story modes lol. Give me the grid and some characters and I’m good lmao

Darc_Requiem · October 13, 2020

The debate over story modes isn't one. NRS games curb stomp the competition sales and its not due to an appeal to the hardcore market. Given the tournament participation, it's obvious what most of the people buying the games purchase them for. What the hardcore FGC needs to realize is that casuals fund their games. Those modes keep the proverbial lights on. Just do what the bulk FPS players do and ignore single player content. Go straight into multiplayer.

BornWinner · October 13, 2020

27 minutes ago, Darc_Requiem said:

Don't tell @Volt(sees the reactions...) too late 😔

To be fair, he reacted much better than I thought he would.

https://twitter.com/lv01kokuen?s=21

I can’t get over this character’s design.

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