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The Street Fighter V Thread, vol. 2

misterBee

By misterBee
in Fighting Game Discussion

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DoctaMario Level 17

DoctaMario

Posted
Posted
On 12/11/2021 at 5:36 PM, Mattatsu said:

I hear ya lol. The graphics, animations, models, and just overall presentation (colours, etc) is a huge downgrade going back to X.

I don't think so at all. Maybe it's because I'm playing the switch version of mk11 but even though I like 11, it feels like it has less personality overall. MKX feels, looks, and sounds like an MK game where I get vibes like they were trying to blend MK.and Injustice with mk11. I like the dark vibes they went with in X and the variation system is so much better in that game. I actually prefer 11's gameplay and that it has a little more neutral than X, but for everything else, I prefer X. 

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Mattatsu Level 14

Mattatsu

Posted
Posted
43 minutes ago, DoctaMario said:

I don't think so at all. Maybe it's because I'm playing the switch version of mk11 but even though I like 11, it feels like it has less personality overall. MKX feels, looks, and sounds like an MK game where I get vibes like they were trying to blend MK.and Injustice with mk11. I like the dark vibes they went with in X and the variation system is so much better in that game. I actually prefer 11's gameplay and that it has a little more neutral than X, but for everything else, I prefer X. 

I agree with most of this really…

Spoiler

You are right that MKX has more personality and feels/looks more like an MK game. 11 does seem like a blend with Injustice (especially in the costume designs of Kronika and her allies, but the influence stretches outside of that as well).

 

The variation system in 11 is trash. X did it better, but 11 was so bad that I hope they abandon it for the next game. I just want powerful and fun characters with a complete moveset. A lot of characters in 11 feel like the weakest they’ve ever been.

 

I also prefer the neutral of 11. Whiff-punishing is fairly common in it, and I love that.

 

I definitely prefer the combo variety and expression in X though. Every starter had so many routes that you could chose optimal combos based on difficulty/reliability, or the connection, etc.

 

I will say that I didn’t like the colouring and darkness of X though. I feel many of the levels are very dark, and even the ones that occur outside during the day have some weird saturation effect going on where the colours seem very muted. Almost like someone smeared Vaseline over them. I do prefer the brighter palette in 11, but personally, I think 9 nailed it the best out of the NRS games.

 

I also love the character models and faces in 11. They almost look like real people, and they did an amazing job here. X definitely has more personality itself, but because the characters look more realistic in 11, I am more connected to them, if that makes sense.

 

The animations in NRS games has been a sore spot for me. In X, almost everything is very janky. 11 fixed this, but in a way, it is almost too stiff in some areas… I wish NRS would really apply some animation principles to have animations/movement be more fluid and impactful. Also, some of the moves are clear poses rather than an actual move being performed and captured with a slow-mo camera… I’m nitpicking now, but when you make hyper realistic character models, it looks real out of place when they do some wonky shit… Actually, I do suppose in this way, X has a leg up (Terminator D3 pun intended) because the models don’t look so realistic to begin with that they can get by with some of jankiness and it just work within the confines of the game.

 

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Volt Level 15

Volt

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, Hawkingbird said:

Who got BlazBlue on steam here? I need to get my Tager back and it would be nice to play with buddies.

From memory, at least me, @Mattatsu@Mr.Cipher got it.

 

I dunno what's Naeras/Bager's name here, but he got it too and was playing at least up to yesterday. Lemme check my steam profile since I pretty much got everyone here in it anyway...

 

According to Steam, @Vhozite@Sonero@Shahenzanand @Hawkingbirdgot it too... Wait, you're Hawk. 🤣

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Dayaan Level 13

Dayaan

Posted
Posted
13 hours ago, Mattatsu said:

I really hope this game has rollback

 

Also, my new computer came in. Took a long time to get it setup, but it seems to run great. Played MK11 for a few minutes (mostly just to get the Kitana 24hr Krypt event).

 

@Vhozite and @Dayaan I’ll be able to play you guys this weekend.

 

I’ll also need to figure out how to get MVC2 running in fightcade2, and play a healthy amount of Doom Eternal.

Oh no...

 

I have finals...

 

I can play next weekend, if that's ok with you.

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Sonero Level 17

Sonero

Posted
Posted

Luke's VS2 is kind crazy. There was talk in a random place about the thing being ass. So I figured why not, lets talk a look at the thing for 10 mins to see what the deal is:

 

16 frame start up

Throw invincible from frames 7-11

+2 on hit

-2 on block.

 

But that throw invincible thing got to me because its where most people would say it doesn't make sense. But when you look at it, you realize that this is there to blow people up teching period. Which is also how it worked out in training mode.

 

Luke doesn't have a lot in the plus frame territory. His main tick throw that's frame tight is going to be from cr.lp. So when this fool has you cornered and is giving you SF5 classic gameplay, things get all screwed up if he is playing with VS2. Low level people are going to do early techs all day or take the throw because they don't know any better.  Doing Cr.lp, VS2 as a blockstring blows that up free for hella damage. You can cancel VS2 on hit for some fat damage and stun with one bar of meter. So god save if you dared to tech becuase you're eating 250ish damage and 355 stun.

 

But if you got a high level player that you're working over in the corner, they are super boned. Throw invincible from 7-11 means that this will catch people late teching too.  Once you get to mid ~ high level play, you don't (or basically you shouldn't be) teching at the earliest possible time. You wait a little bit then tech. This lets you tech safely against meaties and some frame trap. 7-11 means you catch people doing late techs too. Luke is going to blow you up for touching those two buttons hard.

 

Alright that's fine, but at high level people also backdash. This is also where this v-skill gets frisky with people.  The same timing to blow up early tech and late tech also claps backdash. If they did an early backdash you'll catch them standing and can cancel the hit into w/e special you want, if you catch them airborne they get put in a juggle state and you cancel into w/e you want.

 

Tl;DR:

 

When Luke has an opponent cornered, VS2 will blow up:

 

Early tech

Late Tech

Backdashes

V-shift

and people mashing on SPD.

 

Alright, so you have VS2, you cr.lp somebody in the corner for a tick throw, they can't do early/late tech, they can't backdash, what happens if they read a frame trap and v-shift? The VS2 hits late so it won't trigger the V-Shift activation and you punish it. It lands as a counterhit so you can do cr.lp, st.lp target combo, cancel the initial hit into a special etc.

 

What beats you doing cr.lp, VS2 as a string? Dudes feeling suicidal and trying to hit a button after your +2 or EX DP/Supers.  Maybe jump over it since the whole thing is 37 frames in duration. But Zangief can't either EX SPD it or Super it. So even Gief gonna hold that pressure.

 

If they block, you're at -2 which isn't great but its standard SF5. You do have an EX DP so that's how it goes with them -2s in this game. But you can also autopilot the thing and just buffer EX fireball which if the v-skill gets blocked will leave you at +2, the if the v-skill lands you get to juggle with HP DP for fat damage. You can also bufffer v-trigger activation and it'll activate on hit/block leaving you with contineu

 

What should you do when Luke has you cornered? block the frame trap or take the throw. Just ignore that you can do any of those other 4 things unless you have a read or feel like dying. I'm not really sure why one move is basically an OS against 4 things but here we are.

 

🧐

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Pair of Rooks Level 14

Pair of Rooks

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, Sonero said:

Luke's VS2 is kind crazy. There was talk in a random place about the thing being ass. So I figured why not, lets talk a look at the thing for 10 mins to see what the deal is:

 

16 frame start up

Throw invincible from frames 7-11

+2 on hit

-2 on block.

 

But that throw invincible thing got to me because its where most people would say it doesn't make sense. But when you look at it, you realize that this is there to blow people up teching period. Which is also how it worked out in training mode.

 

Luke doesn't have a lot in the plus frame territory. His main tick throw that's frame tight is going to be from cr.lp. So when this fool has you cornered and is giving you SF5 classic gameplay, things get all screwed up if he is playing with VS2. Low level people are going to do early techs all day or take the throw because they don't know any better.  Doing Cr.lp, VS2 as a blockstring blows that up free for hella damage. You can cancel VS2 on hit for some fat damage and stun with one bar of meter. So god save if you dared to tech becuase you're eating 250ish damage and 355 stun.

 

But if you got a high level player that you're working over in the corner, they are super boned. Throw invincible from 7-11 means that this will catch people late teching too.  Once you get to mid ~ high level play, you don't (or basically you shouldn't be) teching at the earliest possible time. You wait a little bit then tech. This lets you tech safely against meaties and some frame trap. 7-11 means you catch people doing late techs too. Luke is going to blow you up for touching those two buttons hard.

 

Alright that's fine, but at high level people also backdash. This is also where this v-skill gets frisky with people.  The same timing to blow up early tech and late tech also claps backdash. If they did an early backdash you'll catch them standing and can cancel the hit into w/e special you want, if you catch them airborne they get put in a juggle state and you cancel into w/e you want.

 

Tl;DR:

 

When Luke has an opponent cornered, VS2 will blow up:

 

Early tech

Late Tech

Backdashes

V-shift

and people mashing on SPD.

 

Alright, so you have VS2, you cr.lp somebody in the corner for a tick throw, they can't do early/late tech, they can't backdash, what happens if they read a frame trap and v-shift? The VS2 hits late so it won't trigger the V-Shift activation and you punish it. It lands as a counterhit so you can do cr.lp, st.lp target combo, cancel the initial hit into a special etc.

 

What beats you doing cr.lp, VS2 as a string? Dudes feeling suicidal and trying to hit a button after your +2 or EX DP/Supers.  Maybe jump over it since the whole thing is 37 frames in duration. But Zangief can't either EX SPD it or Super it. So even Gief gonna hold that pressure.

 

If they block, you're at -2 which isn't great but its standard SF5. You do have an EX DP so that's how it goes with them -2s in this game. But you can also autopilot the thing and just buffer EX fireball which if the v-skill gets blocked will leave you at +2, the if the v-skill lands you get to juggle with HP DP for fat damage. You can also bufffer v-trigger activation and it'll activate on hit/block leaving you with contineu

 

What should you do when Luke has you cornered? block the frame trap or take the throw. Just ignore that you can do any of those other 4 things unless you have a read or feel like dying. I'm not really sure why one move is basically an OS against 4 things but here we are.

 

🧐

 

Can't these weird SFV players take this shit to a thread of their own or something

 

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Sonero Level 17

Sonero

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, Darc_Requiem said:

Pair we may have to join the Cult of Weeb fam.

 

You know how SF5 is tedious between v-skills and having to learn v-triggers?

 

BlazBlue is originator of "every character is a snowflake". There are 4 buttons, A B C and D. The D button, called the drive, is central to w/e gimmick they gave your character. It could be an attack or it could make them fly away. 

 

Who know what wonderful world of different meters and random bullshit you'll find in BlazBlue?

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Sonero Level 17

Sonero

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, Darc_Requiem said:

I appreciate the Luke VS2 info. No one is really exploring it from what I've seen. I've seen a few people, Mister Crimson, use V-Trigger 2. But V-SKill 2 hasn't had much play.

 

Had a homie tell me to make a vid about but eh.

 

The thing about it is that its great at dealing with high level defense. Late tech and backdashes are way more common after you get to a certain level play where people have to maximize stuff. In one of the US SFL matches, Nephew backdashed a throw and punished it with St.HP xx stuff for the win. That same scenario with Luke is way different because after the cr.lp for a tick throw, you deal with the frame trap/throw/shimmy situation but you have to then add VS2 to it that'll blow up multiple options to deal with a backdash/shimmy/v-shift.

 

I can point to a high number of situations where if Zeku had this, I'd blown up @Doctrine_Darkfor his teching tendencies. But at Doctrine's level, they aren't letting Rog get away with installing a damn thing (evern Brian F made a vid about how you can punish Rog doing VS2 on a lot of common knockdowns that rog has) so its probably a very similar situation with Luke. Doctrine wasn't letting me whiff a Tenki with old Zeku, I don't imagine him letting people do silly stuff in front of him unanswered.

 

Either way, I was told it was trash, labbed it for some 15 minutes and found all that. Definitely not a trash v-skill. This thing is gonna randomly come up to ruin somebody's tournament run and then there's going to be a metric ton of salty tweets about it.

 

What do I know though?

 

🧐

 

 

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Volt Level 15

Volt

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Sonero said:

 

You know how SF5 is tedious between v-skills and having to learn v-triggers?

 

BlazBlue is originator of "every character is a snowflake". There are 4 buttons, A B C and D. The D button, called the drive, is central to w/e gimmick they gave your character. It could be an attack or it could make them fly away. 

 

Who know what wonderful world of different meters and random bullshit you'll find in BlazBlue?

On the other hand, you can quickly have a good idea of what a character is supposed to do by just checking their D. ( ⏸️)

 

For example, you know from a glance Nu is gonna fling swords at you, Kagura is a stance character, Tsubaki got enhanceable specials, Azrael wants to set debuffs for big damage...

 

It's not perfect, sure, but it works as a short summary of sorts.

 

BBCF also had a massive overhaul on Dustloop Wiki, so it's easier to check on characters quickly with all the info you could possibly want.

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Mr.Cipher Level 11

Mr.Cipher

Posted
Posted
30 minutes ago, Darc_Requiem said:

If you wanted to tempt @Pair of Rooksand me too the dark side, you should have went with Nine or Litchi. I looked up the roster, then I remembered did buy a Blazblue game before, Calamity Trigger IIRC, and it wasn't my cup of tea. 

 

You mean this?

Spoiler


9003b60a34931161763549ae29a8901d.gif

 

Game is pretty different from CT tbh. the most important part is that Arakune is way less broken!

 

litchi-panda2.gif

 

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misterBee Level 18

misterBee

Posted
  • Author
Posted
57 minutes ago, Darc_Requiem said:

If you wanted to tempt @Pair of Rooksand me too the dark side, you should have went with Nine or Litchi. I looked up the roster, then I remembered did buy a Blazblue game before, Calamity Trigger IIRC, and it wasn't my cup of tea. 

Calamity Trigger is such a different game to current BB.  I wouldn't base anything off of what you remember from that.

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Hecatom Level 18

Hecatom

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Darc_Requiem said:

If you wanted to tempt @Pair of Rooksand me too the dark side, you should have went with Nine or Litchi. I looked up the roster, then I remembered did buy a Blazblue game before, Calamity Trigger IIRC, and it wasn't my cup of tea. 

BBCT is a different beast altoguether.

There were drastic changes in mechanics and character movesets with each iteration of the game, like if instead of being revisions, they were entirely new games in some cases with how different the games play.

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misterBee Level 18

misterBee

Posted
  • Author
Posted
45 minutes ago, Volt said:

To put it in a simpler way, @Darc_RequiemBBCT is about as different from BBCF as 3S is to SFV.

Why would you put it this way?  What is wrong with you?

 

39 minutes ago, Mattatsu said:

So BBCF sucks?

BBCF is degenerate and scummy.  But it's no SFV.  Nothing is SFV.

 

2 hours ago, Psychoblue said:

Other than the obvious albatross of the netcode that gave rollback at a bad name, how are you guys feeling about SFVCE now that it's at its final hour.  

Still do not like.

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